The state of healers is affecting everyone

[Nyvara]

I think healers quitting is more of a earnest desire than it is a reality. Truth is healer mains, like all other mains do things outside of their chosen role. They craft, gather, decorate their houses, level other jobs, go solo, etc. It's getting late into 5.0 now, and most are waiting for 5.1 content to continue their progression. The few healers you're seeing around now, are likely either catching up, are casual, or they are alts to those who normally main a DPS or tank.

The actual state of healers really isn't that bad. Not so bad that we're in the middle of some kind of healer revolt. Some healers are still sour because of changes to AST and SCH, but for the most they've adjusted and have taken their healers to max level and into the current raid tier. Once an expansion is out, a player can continue to cry about the changes, or find a way to adjust and provide constructive feedback. Or play something else. Either way, it won't be until next expansion that major changes happen to jobs.

tl;dr Suck it up cupcakes!

[Billythepancake]

I was just thinking about AST cards in the shower. It would be cool if they could combine the new and old systems into something better. Keep the +dmg from the new system so that there are no 'useless' cards, but remove the bonus dmg for using them on specific roles and replace that condition with a secondary effect unique to each card: Bole (+def), Ewer (mp refresh), Spire (+determination), Spear (+crit), Balance (+directhit), Arrow (+atk spd). So they all do +3% dmg dealt in addition to those other effects. And as a quick fix to make dpsing slightly more interesting, bring back Break role action (light dmg and heavy) but turn it into an off-gcd ability with a fairly short CD for weaving in between malefic/broil/glare.

The problem if you did that though, people would just go back to fishing for balance/spear because those would be bigger damage increases than any other card. What I would do instead,if the goal was to have the best of both card systems, would be to completely eliminate any damage gains from the base cards,make every single one utility including spear and balance. I woul keep minor arcana as is though, change divination to just be 6 percent increase of damage every 2 miniutes and completely gut that seal nonsense.

Is it the perfect system? No, but I think it's an okay compromise for the people who like the old AST and the people who like the new one (as few as they are)

[DynnDiablos]

Have no FEAR!! Sylvi is here! While I can't change the entire state of healers for the game, I will tell you as someone who has avoided healing, I have now leveled WHM, SCH and now AST and I am loving it.

I shall heal! I shall help the queues. Trust in me! It's in the cards!

[Granyala]

The crux is that everything that is scripted becomes brain dead easy once you memorized every single step of it. They could make encounter mechanics more random, but look at all the whining that went on when they did that with Rathalos.

I never managed to kill Rathalos ex.
The encounter wasn't hard to execute but server lag + instagib + 3 deaths = wipe made it ridiculously frustrating.
Also, playing a dispel bot in phase 2 wasn't my idea of having a good time, so I never bothered to search for more groups.

If Rathalos is what they'd do with non scripted stuff, I'll take scripted any day.
You are right though: most MMO players would be completely lost if encounters started to behave in a more unforseeable manner. Most players, even most raiders have to learn the patterns the hard way and have very, very little situational awareness and subsequently it is super hard for them to adapt on the fly.

[RoyalBeef]

I never managed to kill Rathalos ex.
The encounter wasn't hard to execute but server lag + instagib + 3 deaths = wipe made it ridiculously frustrating.
Also, playing a dispel bot in phase 2 wasn't my idea of having a good time, so I never bothered to search for more groups.

If Rathalos is what they'd do with non scripted stuff, I'll take scripted any day.
You are right though: most MMO players would be completely lost if encounters started to behave in a more unforseeable manner. Most players, even most raiders have to learn the patterns the hard way and have very, very little situational awareness and subsequently it is super hard for them to adapt on the fly.

Yeah, you already see that when 3 people argue about who is R1 Vary slightly from what they are used to and it dissolves into chaos ^^

[Hatstand]

I was just thinking about AST cards in the shower. It would be cool if they could combine the new and old systems into something better. Keep the +dmg from the new system so that there are no 'useless' cards, but remove the bonus dmg for using them on specific roles and replace that condition with a secondary effect unique to each card: Bole (+def), Ewer (mp refresh), Spire (+determination), Spear (+crit), Balance (+directhit), Arrow (+atk spd). So they all do +3% dmg dealt in addition to those other effects. And as a quick fix to make dpsing slightly more interesting, bring back Break role action (light dmg and heavy) but turn it into an off-gcd ability with a fairly short CD for weaving in between malefic/broil/glare.

Assuming that there are classes with mana issues, every card was a dps gain in some way (except probably spire). Bole meant you could spare a few healing gcds and get in an extra Malefic or two. Ewer on a job that had some mana heavy but powerful spells available would let them churn out a few extra of them. The “problem” has never been “useless cards” (except maybe spire, but at least that was still useful for royal road). The “problem” was cards that were less useful than others.

I say “problem” in quotes because getting upset that every card you draw isn’t balance is kind of like getting upset that every one of your hits isn’t a crit. Yes, sometimes the rng gives you better results than others. The fact that some cards are more useful than others is only a problem if the difference is stark enough that you would always throw away whatever you have if it’s not a balance on the 1/5 chance that you’ll redraw a balance, thus making optimal play something that is un-fun and clunky (much like current AST optimal play). However, we could have ensured that the old system didn’t fall into that trap, rather than turning AST into a balance-bot.

The old system could have been improved by a) nerfing balance such that it was mathematically better to make the most out of your hand than to balance fish, b) bag randomise the cards so that you don’t get long strings of the same card you don’t want, and c) include some mechanism for mitigating it randomness, like a cooldown that would let you draw a card of your choice (it could use the same mechanism as dancer steps, changing basic moves into cards that you could select).

The new system is just boring. It requires a lot of mechanical fiddlyness but not much thought. I don’t think this new card system really has a hope of becoming something fun. AST either needs a reversion or another overhaul.

[EaMett]

I think healers quitting is more of a earnest desire than it is a reality. Truth is healer mains, like all other mains do things outside of their chosen role. They craft, gather, decorate their houses, level other jobs, go solo, etc. It's getting late into 5.0 now, and most are waiting for 5.1 content to continue their progression. The few healers you're seeing around now, are likely either catching up, are casual, or they are alts to those who normally main a DPS or tank.

The actual state of healers really isn't that bad. Not so bad that we're in the middle of some kind of healer revolt. Some healers are still sour because of changes to AST and SCH, but for the most they've adjusted and have taken their healers to max level and into the current raid tier. Once an expansion is out, a player can continue to cry about the changes, or find a way to adjust and provide constructive feedback. Or play something else. Either way, it won't be until next expansion that major changes happen to jobs.

I mean, this thread is full of healers that have stopped playing that role. Also the state of static recruitment has been going through a dry spell of healers ever since slightly before the expansion (short of whm which there seem to be a decent amount of atm). And the healers you do find generally don't have logs past the current tier (aka weren't healers or even around during SB raids) so usually have limited raiding experience.
A lot of us who stuck around don't enjoy the changes but did so because the role suits us or we already had a static. All in all considering these past 4 years they've made changes that consistently go against what we've been wanting, we surely are going to whine until something is done. Even if that's in 2 years. Though I'm sure in 2 years they'll find another way of going against what people have been asking.. again.

Edit: also the changes aren't so bad if you're new or not really optimizing your class. As soon as you start optimizing it's a big slap in the face compared to what we had before. Went from managing many aspects on sch, from weave window timers (miasma II), multiple dots (significantly diff from handling a single dot), micromanaging a fairy, melee placement for miasma II, shadowflare you had to time/place correctly. It's a lot we lost (thank god they gave us ED back, dunno what on earth they were thinking)

[Duskane]

I never managed to kill Rathalos ex.
The encounter wasn't hard to execute but server lag + instagib + 3 deaths = wipe made it ridiculously frustrating.
Also, playing a dispel bot in phase 2 wasn't my idea of having a good time, so I never bothered to search for more groups.

If Rathalos is what they'd do with non scripted stuff, I'll take scripted any day.
You are right though: most MMO players would be completely lost if encounters started to behave in a more unforseeable manner. Most players, even most raiders have to learn the patterns the hard way and have very, very little situational awareness and subsequently it is super hard for them to adapt on the fly.

yeah Rathalos isnt very hard
but sooo many people do mess it up
sure its janky
but seriously in the final phase if you stay behind his tail always he cant get you outside of the stack mechanic

[Gemina]

I mean, this thread is full of healers that have stopped playing that role. Also the state of static recruitment has been going through a dry spell of healers ever since slightly before the expansion (short of whm which there seem to be a decent amount of atm). And the healers you do find generally don't have logs past the current tier (aka weren't healers or even around during SB raids) so usually have limited raiding experience.
A lot of us who stuck around don't enjoy the changes but did so because the role suits us or we already had a static. All in all considering these past 4 years they've made changes that consistently go against what we've been wanting, we surely are going to whine until something is done. Even if that's in 2 years. Though I'm sure in 2 years they'll find another way of going against what people have been asking.. again.

Edit: also the changes aren't so bad if you're new or not really optimizing your class. As soon as you start optimizing it's a big slap in the face compared to what we had before. Went from managing many aspects on sch, from weave window timers (miasma II), multiple dots (significantly diff from handling a single dot), micromanaging a fairy, melee placement for miasma II, shadowflare you had to time/place correctly. It's a lot we lost (thank god they gave us ED back, dunno what on earth they were thinking)

The healers here on the forums represent a small portion of the community as a whole, and when you start tossing words like "optimization" and fflogs out there, you basically severe the silent majority who either don't/can't/won't use the tools that monitor the stats. I'm not saying all these players are content with the changes, but the difference lies within any player's enjoyment and/or willingness to play any given job and max it out.

You can talk about how SCH was gutted all day long, and while I don't disagree, mentioning its former DPS rotation as a focal point of the job is exactly why it's gone. It was the epitome of a green DPS, and we either have to face the fact that this is not how the devs and a lot of players want our healers to be, or look the other direction.

[ForteNightshade]

You can talk about how SCH was gutted all day long, and while I don't disagree, mentioning its former DPS rotation as a focal point of the job is exactly why it's gone. It was the epitome of a green DPS, and we either have to face the fact that this is not how the devs and a lot of players want our healers to be, or look the other direction.

Except they're still green DPS, which is part of the problem. People wouldn't be complaining if they added new and interesting healing mechanics alongside more intense healing to keep people both busy and engaged. They did neither. Instead, they neutered the DPS aspect, kept heal scaling as though it were still Stormblood and called it a day. Scholar does only a few hundred rDPS less than all four tanks now. And with the little amount of healing required outside Titan Savage, nothing changed. You'll just be spamming Broil instead of more dot management.