Do SMN and BRD need 2 DoTs?

[YusiKha]

are we gonna end up with 1 button to press in 6.0? big thonk tbh

I feel like you’re missing the point. DoTs are basically 1 button already, and just add to button bloat. They should either be made interesting (like the differing duration I have already mentioned) or just go.

[AnimaAnimus]

I feel like you’re missing the point. DoTs are basically 1 button already, and just add to button bloat. They should either be made interesting (like the differing duration I have already mentioned) or just go.

To be fair, this could be said for regular dps moves too. Ruin 2 and Ruin 3 only do flat damage, and they are both on the same timer, do we really need two? I mean can't we just combine them into one?

DoT jobs are DoT jobs and flat dmg jobs are flat dmg jobs. Just cause we have 2 abilities that do the same thing doesn't mean we should merge them or get rid of one cause reasons.

[YusiKha]

To be fair, this could be said for regular dps moves too. Ruin 2 and Ruin 3 only do flat damage, and they are both on the same timer, do we really need two? I mean can't we just combine them into one?

DoT jobs are DoT jobs and flat dmg jobs are flat dmg jobs. Just cause we have 2 abilities that do the same thing doesn't mean we should merge them or get rid of one cause reasons.

Ruin 3 and Ruin 2 do different things though, as one has a cast time and higher damage, the other is instant but allows abilities to be weaved. This is more akin to asking that ruin 2 turn into ruin 4 instead of being separate buttons.

[JowyAtreides]

Ruin 3 and Ruin 2 do different things though, as one has a cast time and higher damage, the other is instant but allows abilities to be weaved. This is more akin to asking that ruin 2 turn into ruin 4 instead of being separate buttons.

You've answered your own question here for Summoner. Miasma has a cast time and Bio is instant and I think different potencies (can't check from work).

Bards rely on DoT ticks critting to proc their songs effects, they arguably care less for the actual damage of the DoT's than for the frequency, so your suggestion would need to come with a damage per half second (for example) counter. They also have a pair of skills that has potency dependent on the number of DoT's are on the enemies so these would need reworking. They've also got almost no skills to play with anymore, I sort of wish they had 3 DoT's personally, such as a fire arrow that does burn damage.

[HyoMinPark]

I sort of wish they had 3 DoT's personally, such as a fire arrow that does burn damage.

RIP Flaming Arrow. Thou shalt never be forgotten.

[JowyAtreides]

RIP Flaming Arrow. Thou shalt never be forgotten.

Oh this was a thing? I only played as early as 2.0 and they only skill I remember losing was that "needle-like" rain of arrows

[HyoMinPark]

Oh this was a thing? I only played as early as 2.0 and they only skill I remember losing was that "needle-like" rain of arrows

Flaming Arrow was a 30s ground AOE that dealt damage over time to all who went into it. It was on a 60s cooldown and could snapshot raid buffs. It was a part of BRD from 2.0 to the end of HW. They removed it going into Stormblood.

If you’re talking about Rain of Death, BRD still has that.

Im not advocating for the dumbing down of summoner or bard, I’m highlighting that there are redundant skills.

Simplifying them into a single button is dumbing them down. BRD already lost enough of its complexity going into ShB—it really doesn’t need to lose anything else.

[Mansion]

Oh this was a thing? I only played as early as 2.0 and they only skill I remember losing was that "needle-like" rain of arrows

It was yeah, I think it was some ground AoE targetting, and it got removed in Stormblood if I remember correctly.


I'm with Hyomin there, plus maining SMN : Two DoTs is fine, as long as the rotation gives you efficient tools for DoT uptime management (which Bard has, and SMN too outside of 2-3 seconds every 2 minutes).
Button bloat is not a thing on Bard, really.
On SMN that's a thing perhaps, but I don't think that's the first thing that should be considered.

If you’re talking about Rain of Death, BRD still has that.

I think they are talking about Wide Volley, that rain of purplish/pinkish thin arrows.

[YusiKha]

You've answered your own question here for Summoner. Miasma has a cast time and Bio is instant and I think different potencies (can't check from work).

Bards rely on DoT ticks critting to proc their songs effects, they arguably care less for the actual damage of the DoT's than for the frequency, so your suggestion would need to come with a damage per half second (for example) counter. They also have a pair of skills that has potency dependent on the number of DoT's are on the enemies so these would need reworking. They've also got almost no skills to play with anymore, I sort of wish they had 3 DoT's personally, such as a fire arrow that does burn damage.

The cast time on miasma means that it and bio can be applied simultaneously, and having the same duration means that they should always be applied simultaneously. There’s no point in them being separate because they’re always used together, like Berserk and Inner Release.
Im not advocating for the dumbing down of summoner or bard, I’m highlighting that there are redundant skills.

[Drashir]

The cast time on miasma means that it and bio can be applied simultaneously, and having the same duration means that they should always be applied simultaneously. There’s no point in them being separate because they’re always used together, like Berserk and Inner Release.
Im not advocating for the dumbing down of summoner or bard, I’m highlighting that there are redundant skills.

Most dot based pet classes in any game have more then 1 dot. its not redundant its a fundamental part of most DOT/PET classes.
Although summoner needs a complete overhaul to be honest. The summons are useless glorified pets that have no real value. That needs to be addressed more then dots