Dark Knight: 5.0x Feedback Thread

[RadicalPesto]

Spoken like a true savage raider who has no respect for the rest of the games content. So nothing else matters till you get to the "real" game? Which Savage is? We shouldn't worry what happens to anyone in the first 79 levels or the MSQ? Balance doesn't matter at all?

Yes, in fact, "balance" doesn't matter at all in content below extreme difficulty. You might be thinking of "fun", which several classes lack severely while levelling due to some of them having really strange skill distributions (Black Mage for example turns into an entirely different class when it obtains Fire IV), but "balance" is utterly irrelevant when it comes to content where the performance requirements are so low that you can reasonably clear them with people sleep at the wheel.

I have to admit its funny to use "Savage raider" as some kind of bad thing to call someone, it seems you just wanted to say "elitist", when its a simple fact that every single balance element of this game is designed around 8 man parties engaging against content with tankbusters, raidbusters, and DPS checks, hence why skills like Trick Attack only achieve their correct potential with 8 players. Also, more than half of what you described isn't even utility, Blood Weapon was a rotational buff, Carve and Spit could hardly be called a choice and wasn't "utility" either, Delirium was also a rotational buff, TBN giving blood was meant to be a return for your DPS expense and is in fact, also, not utility. The definition of utility you're using here is so off that it would define Lance Charge, Inner Release and even Hissatsu Kaiten as utility skills.

[Deceptus]

Yes, in fact, "balance" doesn't matter at all in content below extreme difficulty.

Bull. . .

You can't ignore 95% of the game. That would be extremely stupid.

Currently all tank jobs are extremely simple in their DPS rotations and very similar in mitigation. We could afford to make just one of them more demanding for people who enjoy something different.

If you want complex DPS rotations, play a DPS. At least, that's what everyone seemed to be screaming at the healers when we provided push back on our 2 button dps rotations.

[Satarn]

If you want complex DPS rotations, play a DPS. At least, that's what everyone seemed to be screaming at the healers when we provided push back on our 2 button dps rotations.

Yeah, I'm sure taking your salt with a couple of forum princesses out on tanks is gonna make SE fix your healers. You go fight that good fight. /s
Also if the plural "you" provided push back, then clearly it wasn't "everyone" screaming against it. In fact I keep seeing plenty of people both here and on reddit being(understandably) displeased with the state of the healer role.

Actually it's not just tanks and healers - the one DPS I liked to play in SB(MNK) got dumbed down just as much as tanks and sounds like NIN's gonna follow suit, so that's not even an option lul. That's disregarding the fact that I enjoy tanking for what the role itself is: planning mitigation, positioning and making fights as comfy for everyone else as possible. I just also happen to like having something more on top of that.

Perhaps instead of getting snarky with each other, we could all show SE that there's still audience for more complex jobs in this game and thus leaving a couple of them more complicated would be a more widely appealing design, regardless of role.

[Reynhart]

You can't ignore 95% of the game. That would be extremely stupid.

That's not ignoring. Balance is only relevant so that no job is excluded in party setup. For 95% of the game, people don't care about party setup.

[Absimiliard]

That's not ignoring. Balance is only relevant so that no job is excluded in party setup. For 95% of the game, people don't care about party setup.

Tell that to all the ninjas getting kicked out of roulettes now just for existing. :P

[Kabooa]

Tell that to all the ninjas getting kicked out of roulettes now just for existing. :P

I'm sure they're getting kicked for reasons other than being ninjas.

[DemonicNeko]

That's not ignoring. Balance is only relevant so that no job is excluded in party setup. For 95% of the game, people don't care about party setup.

Right now we get the devs saying. "Ninja's have to be shit classes because of Trick Attack." Yet shadowbringers they where like. "You know in Stormblood utility was a major problems. So we got rid of a lot of Utility in the game." Seems like Utility in the game is a problem. Then again it might just be bad boss design. Devs are like. "You know what would be a good savage mechanics? Tripple tank busters." *face paws.* Yes, Bullet spungy boss fights that hit like a truck makes wonderful boss fights.

If bosses and utility where not such an eye sore problems. People would not care for party set up. It would be more about. "Can you stay alive? Can you not wipe the group?"

[Reynhart]

Right now we get the devs saying. "Ninja's have to be shit classes because of Trick Attack." Yet shadowbringers they where like. "You know in Stormblood utility was a major problems. So we got rid of a lot of Utility in the game." Seems like Utility in the game is a problem. Then again it might just be bad boss design. Devs are like. "You know what would be a good savage mechanics? Tripple tank busters." *face paws.* Yes, Bullet spungy boss fights that hit like a truck makes wonderful boss fights.

Getting rid of utility is a big problem because it remove lots of uniqueness in jobs, and how you would decide which job to take. But, from my point of view, the biggest problem is the "one size fits all" party setup. Basically, the optimal setup is the same for every content you do. Depending on the content, some jobs shouls have pros and cons, somehow forcing you to not bring the optimal setup in raids since the weekly lockouts mostly prevents from gearing several jobs at the same time.

But, on the other side, I think people care too much about being "excluded". 95% of the content is done in pick-up where no one wil kick you just for being a "non-optimal" job, and for the other 5%, chances are you play with friends that will focus more on everybody playing jobs they like than them being optimal.

[Absimiliard]

But, on the other side, I think people care too much about being "excluded". 95% of the content is done in pick-up where no one wil kick you just for being a "non-optimal" job, and for the other 5%, chances are you play with friends that will focus more on everybody playing jobs they like than them being optimal.

Tell that to all the ninjas getting kicked excluded from PF groups, kicked from roulettes, etc. The top 5% of the game has asserted that ninja is not adequate - and granted, it isn't - in a very public way. This is having a trickle down effect wherein people on the job are suffering the consequences of its current state in areas of the game where it really doesn't even matter, oft times at the hands of people who are themselves nowhere near capable of doing endgame content. It's not a common sight right now, but we could end up with another pre-final coil dragoon situation if it gets left unchecked.

[shao32]

Tell that to all the ninjas getting kicked excluded from PF groups, kicked from roulettes, etc. The top 5% of the game has asserted that ninja is not adequate - and granted, it isn't - in a very public way. This is having a trickle down effect wherein people on the job are suffering the consequences of its current state in areas of the game where it really doesn't even better, oft times at the hands of people who are themselves nowhere near capable of doing endgame content. It's not a common sight right now, but we could end up with another pre-final coil dragoon situation if it gets left unchecked.

I think you are overexagerating nobody is kicking NIN for get one in roulettes apart of being stupid since NIN are not as bad in terms of numbers compared to other jobs that past for the same situation in the past is kinda pointless kick them for no reason and i see no one here or any place claiming being kicked like that after get in to a roulette. excluded from PF groups can be a thing but mostly on PF that are forming a static, on normal runs nobody cares and i being in a plenty of partys on PF and none of them lock NIN here on chaos since NIN is a viable job and is capable to clear everything, heck even my static have a NIN and we don't have DPS problems to clear any boss.