So, can we just ban damage meters already.

[Driavna]

The good thing about healers is that you have two rankings. I'm not impressed by a healer that parse purple on damage but do grey on healing while his co-healer is parsing purple on both.

[Billythepancake]

The good thing about healers is that you have two rankings. Good ones are going to do a decent job at both, bad ones are going to be bad at one or the other and really bad healer are going to be bad at both. I'm not impressed by a healer that parse purple on damage but they are grey on healing while his co-healer is parsing purple at both.

Heh, in fairness, in an optimal setting both healers have grey healing. I moreso try to look at how close the HPS is, and if they're not close together to see what the overheal is on the healer with the higher healing is. If the HPS is like 13k vs 7k, but the 13k has 65% overheal, I wouldn't consider the second healer bad at all, since over half of the other healers healing was unnecessary.

[AmeliaVerves]

Heh, in fairness, in an optimal setting both healers have grey healing. I moreso try to look at how close the HPS is, and if they're not close together to see what the overheal is on the healer with the higher healing is. If the HPS is like 13k vs 7k, but the 13k has 65% overheal, I wouldn't consider the second healer bad at all, since over half of the other healers healing was unnecessary.

Afaik fflogs already excludes the overheal in the actual HPS numbers. So it would be 13k effective healing and 65% MORE on top which was pure overheal.

Regarding differences in healings, it's not always that easy to determine if the contribution of healing was 'fair' or not and needs to be done on a case to case basis.

This is taken from one of my very own e1s parses (I'm the whm) and while one might say 'whm had to heal way too much!' I strongly disagree bc the sch and me both hit a very good rank on dps too. It really boils down to healing potencies and therefore it's hard to judge healer logs imo.


The sad thing is, a lot of ppl judge parsers/fflogs and players who use it without knowing what the tools can actualy do for you and how much information you can get out of them the game never offers you. Most players have no clue about their performance and if they don't care that's fair, but if there was an official tool available to improve your performance I believe a lot more ppl would bother using it. Even if it's just to take a casual attempt on bettering yourself I think it would have a huge impact.

[EaMett]

This is taken from one of my very own e1s parses (I'm the whm) and while one might say 'whm had to heal way too much!' I strongly disagree bc the sch and me both hit a very good rank on dps too. It really boils down to healing potencies and therefore it's hard to judge healer logs imo.

WHM will almost always have higher HPS than SCH in optimized play because Afflatus skills should take precedence over SCH oGCDs in a lot of scenarios (esp e1s where you can misery both adds at the very least, probably even moreso if the meteors are in range of the boss but I haven't tested that).

[AmeliaVerves]

WHM will almost always have higher HPS than SCH in optimized play because Afflatus skills should take precedence over SCH oGCDs in a lot of scenarios (esp e1s where you can misery both adds at the very least, probably even moreso if the meteors are in range of the boss but I haven't tested that).

uhm no. In optimized play oGCDs are ALWAYS used 1st and only for phases of high movement or wherever burst healing is needed you want to use rapture or solace.
Even tho Misery is strong, it's still a dps loss. (except some very specific padding situations you just mentioned)
In general oGCDs should be favoured over lily usage.

I absolutely hate damage meters because it takes the fun out of playing the game. Instead of just playing the game and having fun, people are always fixated on the DPS and HPS.

Just play the game, and have fun already.

I'm sorry, Sir/Ma'am, but optimizing my gameplay and pushing my dps and fight cleartimes further and further is the most fun I (and a lot of others) can have in this game. Please accept this, thanks.

[Pharone]

uhm no. In optimized play oGCDs are ALWAYS used 1st and only for phases of high movement or wherever burst healing is needed you want to use rapture or solace.
Even tho Misery is strong, it's still a dps loss. (except some very specific padding situations you just mentioned)
In general oGCDs should be favoured over lily usage.



I'm sorry, Sir/Ma'am, but optimizing my gameplay and pushing my dps and fight cleartimes further and further is the most fun I (and a lot of others) can have in this game. Please accept this, thanks.

I'm not here to tell you how to play your game. I'm just saying that if you use your meters to demand me play a specific way even though everything in the dungeon is dying and we are winning, then that is the point where the damage meter has gone too far.

You play your way, and I will play mine. As a samurai, I stay out of damage, make things die as fast as I can, and kill off adds. If that isn't good enough for you because you wanted x number more DPS out of me while performing my role, then that's your issue; not mine.

[EaMett]

uhm no. In optimized play oGCDs are ALWAYS used 1st and only for phases of high movement or wherever burst healing is needed you want to use rapture or solace.
Even tho Misery is strong, it's still a dps loss. (except some very specific padding situations you just mentioned)
In general oGCDs should be favoured over lily usage.

Afflatus skills are meant to work like oGCD heals. Misery sets each afflatus to be equivalent to a 225 potency dps skill. Which means that using an afflatus skill is the same dps loss as using an oGCD skill. So from the get go no oGCDs aren't always used first since these two can be interchanged. Furthermore, if the WHM needs to use an oGCD in the first place, weaving it into afflatus means that they are being DPS neutral compared to clipping but they get an extra "free" heal to go along with it. Meaning that if you're going to use an ogcd like assize/tetra/asylum/etc.., you might as well carry the healing for that portion with an afflatus skill since there's literally no difference in DPS loss between using the former single heal or the later double heal.
Obviously double weaving into an afflatus skill is a dps gain over clipping. In every case..

Furthermore, the way misery works means that you can turn any DPS neutral scenario into a DPS gain one so long as you 1) hit more than one target, or 2) use misery under any raid buff, or even better during the buff window.

Because of all the above you will prioritize healing with afflatus over your partner's oGCDs the majority of the time. This is even more pronounced when talking about oGCDs that could otherwise be used on energy drain for example.

The caveat is that this only holds true if you use misery in the first place, so afflatus no longer retain their priority if you're nearing the end of the fight and won't get the misery to go along with it.

Afflatus skills would still be used in optimized play even if they didn't do anything other than feed the blood lily, so it's only natural they would be higher priority than other heals.

[Driavna]

Heh, in fairness, in an optimal setting both healers have grey healing. I moreso try to look at how close the HPS is, and if they're not close together to see what the overheal is on the healer with the higher healing is. If the HPS is like 13k vs 7k, but the 13k has 65% overheal, I wouldn't consider the second healer bad at all, since over half of the other healers healing was unnecessary.

You are not wrong and I understand what are you trying to say. Rest assured I take into account what you are saying. Still, I can notice when a healer has DPS tunnel (the same way I understand I using more resources than necessary to heal something and I should be DPsing more) vision so I always check the healing too.

[Granyala]

The good thing about healers is that you have two rankings. I'm not impressed by a healer that parse purple on damage but do grey on healing while his co-healer is parsing purple on both.

Aye. Since my coheal and I have an understanding that she only heals if she feels there is a need to, I get to push as much healing as I can.
Far more fun than DPSing in my opinion and she prefers DPSing. So I'll never get to purple DPS anyway. Sometimes, when everything is good I manage a blue one.

The result (last weeks e1s, second kill IIRC)

(esp e1s where you can misery both adds at the very least, probably even moreso if the meteors are in range of the boss but I haven't tested that).

Lily both adds, yup, that works. Even had a try in which I could do it twice but usually they don't live long enough and I am reluctant to pump lily heals into overheal just to get the DPS goods. I try not to waste any lilies but ultimately, I do not plan my heals around DPS maximization. I plan them according to the needs of the encounter.
Boss +1 meteor would theoretically work too but I don't think our tanks bring Eden close enough.