Lack of action against gathering bots, it needs to be changed, and soon

[SilverObi]

Gathering Bots have been going on since 2010 when 1.0 was released. If what you say is true that gathering bots are destroying the economy, you would think that by 2019, the economy would be so dead that nobody would be crafting and gathering anymore xD. But then again, Raider's don't really think, They just watch guides and use 3rd party apps that execute combos for them so all they have to do is move their character.

You really like making sweeping generalizations don't you. Show us on the mammet where the raider poked you.

[RareItems]

You really like making sweeping generalizations don't you. Show us on the mammet where the raider poked you.

Nope just stating facts. RMT is RMT. Selling Savage Clears/Eden drops, is RMT and should be bannable.

There is literally no difference between someone gathering in a circle for 8 hours, a group of aethersand bots gathering non stop for 2 years, and a shady group of players selling Savage Clears/Drops.

[ForteNightshade]

Nope just stating facts. RMT is RMT. Selling Savage Clears/Eden drops, is RMT and should be bannable.

There is literally no difference between someone gathering in a circle for 8 hours, a group of aethersand bots gathering non stop for 2 years, and a shady group of players selling Savage Clears/Drops.

The irony here is you won't actually get an argument from most people that both should be policed better. Regardless, they aren't the same thing. Someone buying a Savage clear pays a group with real money, said group clears the content on their account and everyone goes about their merry way. A gather bot, meanwhile, collects all their spoils and sells them on the market board—purposely tanking prices because even if something sells for 1,000 gil. It's all pure profit for them.

One impacts the service economy while the other impacts the buyer's wallet.

[SilverObi]

Nope just stating facts. RMT is RMT. Selling Savage Clears/Eden drops, is RMT and should be bannable.

There is literally no difference between someone gathering in a circle for 8 hours, a group of aethersand bots gathering non stop for 2 years, and a shady group of players selling Savage Clears/Drops.

I agree with your first point. It is RMT. But your second point is off because people selling clears doesn't affect my or other's ability to make gil or the health of the ingame economy so there is a difference in urgency at the minimum. If people want to risk bans for exchanging real money for clears on fights that don't reward gil then let them get their punishment in due time, but bots that actively control markets and make the user experience worse are much heavier targets. We shouldn't be using this to beat legit raiders over the head for what a small subset do in any regard.

[Hash_Browns]

I agree with your first point. It is RMT. But your second point is off because people selling clears doesn't affect my or other's ability to make gil or the health of the ingame economy so there is a difference in urgency at the minimum. If people want to risk bans for exchanging real money for clears on fights that don't reward gil then let them get their punishment in due time, but bots that actively control markets and make the user experience worse are much heavier targets. We shouldn't be using this to beat legit raiders over the head for what a small subset do in any regard.

Both are RMT, both need to be solved.
One might effect the economy of the game more, but to me - both are souring to see. Personally speaking, I'm not a crafter, so the bots really don't effect me. If anything, they kinda help me since when I do raids, or trials - I get potions & food at a cheap price, but really, it still just adds a touch of sour to everything I do. It's more about SEs lack of understanding/support/action for the situation then anything at this point.

It's honestly gotten to a point where I am ready to accept the bots, and just well.. let it go.

[RareItems]

The irony here is you won't actually get an argument from most people that both should be policed better. Regardless, they aren't the same thing. Someone buying a Savage clear pays a group with real money, said group clears the content on their account and everyone goes about their merry way. A gather bot, meanwhile, collects all their spoils and sells them on the market board—purposely tanking prices because even if something sells for 1,000 gil. It's all pure profit for them.

One impacts the service economy while the other impacts the buyer's wallet.

FYI: People selling clears negatively impacts the entirety of the game more than that lone player dumping 9999 logs for 500 gil each or that group of Aethersand bots selling aethersands for 300gil each.

1 Group is making things cheaper, while the other is promoting Elitism, Toxicity and Sabotaging PUG Ex/Savage Groups.

If you shutdown players selling clears, more ppl would be more inclined to help get other ppl get their clears instead of having a dollar value attached to it. You will also have more successful PUG Groups since nobody there is going to purposely sabotage it, purposely making it fail so ppl would get frustrated and give up in hopes these players would just buy the clear/item drops.

These ppl selling clears also creates a false narrative that FFXIV's endgame is Raids/Ex Trials when in fact it's just a minor optional content like Lord of Vermillion or Chocobo Racing. The game is better off if they made an improved version of Eureka. SE is literally wasting so much Dev Time creating "Hard" Content for a very small percentage of the playerbase when they should be doing content that can be enjoyed by everyone.

[HyoMinPark]

FYI: People selling clears negatively impacts the entirety of the game more than that lone player dumping 9999 logs for 500 gil each or that group of Aethersand bots selling aethersands for 300gil each.

1 Group is making things cheaper, while the other is promoting Elitism, Toxicity and Sabotaging PUG Ex/Savage Groups.

If you shutdown players selling clears, more ppl would be more inclined to help get other ppl get their clears instead of having a dollar value attached to it. You will also have more successful PUG Groups since nobody there is going to purposely sabotage it, purposely making it fail so ppl would get frustrated and give up in hopes these players would just buy the clear/item drops.

Sabotaging PUG groups? The people selling these runs aren’t like to even join PUGs that frequently... They go about their business and then unsub, usually. So, how are they negatively impacting the PUG scene again? Or are you trying to blame it on the people who bought the clears joining things they aren’t prepared to join? Because then that’s on those players, not the sellers.

I think your tinfoil hat is too tight right now.

These ppl selling clears also creates a false narrative that FFXIV's endgame is Raids/Ex Trials when in fact it's just a minor optional content like Lord of Vermillion or Chocobo Racing. The game is better off if they made an improved version of Eureka. SE is literally wasting so much Dev Time creating "Hard" Content for a very small percentage of the playerbase when they should be doing content that can be enjoyed by everyone.

This is your opinion. However, considering that Ultimate garnered FFXIV the most publicity on sites like Twitch compared to anything else this game has ever offered, I don’t consider it a waste of resources at all. Even non-raiders enjoyed watching the Ultimate spectacle.

As always, your posts are full of baseless assumptions and nothing concrete or productive. Are you done derailing this thread?

How do you know they unsub and don't sabotage PUG groups? How do you know if they helped ppl get their clears for free before Selling Clears was a thing? Selling Clears is against the TOS, its RMT, all it does is promotes Elitism, Toxicity and Griefing. Not to mention Abusing a naive player off his/her hard earned money.

How do you know that they do sabotage runs? Burden of proof is on you, my dude. Since you’re insisting on dying on this hill. So far, you’ve provide no evidence or proof that these players do all the things you’re claiming they do. Meanwhile, it’s fairly well known that high-tier players—the types that would be good enough to do content sales—frequently unsub from the game between tiers.

Selling clears has existed since Titan HM. It’s existed in MMOs aside from this one. You’re acting like this is some kind of new thing. And abusing a naive player into giving away their hard-earned money? The buyers willingly turn over their money for the content they buy. The sellers don’t force them to buy anything, via your conspiracy theories or otherwise. Buyers are well aware of what they’re doing—they buy to get the shinies for next to no effort. Are you sure they’re the naive ones here?

Clear Sellers are just a collection of regular Raiders who are elite enough to be invited to that Savage Clear selling Discord, and if they have a buyer, they ask around for 8 ppl who are interested and they all get a cut.

Somehow, I doubt these people invite any ol’ Raider Joe to sell content with them. Fairly certain that players that sell runs are generally very skilled because a lot of Savage runs involve just having the buyee die and rest 7-man the content.

[ForteNightshade]

FYI: People selling clears negatively impacts the entirety of the game more than that lone player dumping 9999 logs for 500 gil each or that group of Aethersand bots selling aethersands for 300gil each.

1 Group is making things cheaper, while the other is promoting Elitism, Toxicity and Sabotaging PUG Ex/Savage Groups.

If you shutdown players selling clears, more ppl would be more inclined to help get other ppl get their clears instead of having a dollar value attached to it. You will also have more successful PUG Groups since nobody there is going to purposely sabotage it, purposely making it fail so ppl would get frustrated and give up in hopes these players would just buy the clear/item drops.

Cheaper through fraudulent means. Hence why that impacts the game. Or rather, impacts the crafting endgame since it can be next to impossible for legitimate players to compete with a bot.

Meanwhile, I would like to know how groups selling content promotes toxicity when most content sellers simply go about their business. Likewise, how does it sabotage pugs? If they weren't able to sell content any longer, for whatever reason, most would likely unsub not join random PF groups. They don't go around sabotaging pugs. That's just you spreading nonsense.

[RareItems]

Sabotaging PUG groups? The people selling these runs aren’t like to even join PUGs that frequently... They go about their business and then unsub, usually. So, how are they negatively impacting the PUG scene again? Or are you trying to blame it on the people who bought the clears joining things they aren’t prepared to join? Because then that’s on those players, not the sellers.

I think your tinfoil hat is too tight right now.



This is your opinion. However, considering that Ultimate garnered FFXIV the most publicity on sites like Twitch compared to anything else this game has ever offered, I don’t consider it a waste of resources at all. Even non-raiders enjoyed watching the Ultimate spectacle.

As always, your posts are full of baseless assumptions and nothing concrete or productive. Are you done derailing this thread?

How do you know they unsub and don't sabotage PUG groups? How do you know if they helped ppl get their clears for free before Selling Clears was a thing? Selling Clears is against the TOS, its RMT, all it does is promotes Elitism, Toxicity and Griefing. Not to mention Abusing a naive player off his/her hard earned money.

"Hey guys we didnt' have any buyers today, lets unsub and give up" When was the Party Finder introduced again? These sellers have been here since Party Finder was introduced. You really think these guys just unsub? lol.

Clear Sellers are just a collection of regular Raiders who are elite enough to be invited to that Savage Clear selling Discord, and if they have a buyer, they ask around for 8 ppl who are interested and they all get a cut.

[SilverObi]

Nonsense, more nonsense, and paranoid nonsense

Citations please. Please stop making our server look worse.