(ShB Spoilers) Didn't Hydaelyn, uh...

[LineageRazor]

The days prior to the Sundering were ones of monstrous act after monstrous act being performed under circumstances where pretty much every conceivable course of action was a bad one. Summoning Zodiark and the methods for doing so were unconscionable, and yet at the same time I can't really fault the Council for doing so (at least, at our current understanding of the situation).

The best you can say about the Sundering was that it was slightly less bad than the planned murders would have been, and that's IF you agree that memory erasure does not constitute murder. (If you do consider amnesia to be murder, then it's actually worse, since all the planned murder victims were murdered anyway, and everyone else save three were murdered as well.) I'm torn on whether it is or not, and it largely depends on how much of the individual's personality was left intact. In either case, I'd say the Sundering was still a terrible act - but just one more in a long line of terrible, yet arguably necessary acts.

I don't hold Hydaelyn responsible, though - and this is because I no longer really regard Hydaelyn as an entity in her own right. She's a construct, built to do what her summoners created her for. Whether they intended for her to do what she did or not, she believed it was necessary to accomplish her creators' desires. The ones at fault are her summoners, and every one of them is now Sundered (unless it turns out that, in a twist, Elidibus is one of the folks who advocated her Summoning, and has since had a change of heart).

I do feel that Hydaelyn is a benign, benevolent entity NOW, with free agency for existing life as a high priority on her agenda (superseded only, perhaps, by ensuring that efforts of the Ascians to return things to the way they were are thwarted). But what she did with the Sundering could be construed as being as bad morally as what the Ascians are trying to do to reverse it.

On the other hand, from the Exarch's point of view, isn't that basically exactly he did? In his time, the Warrior of Light was dead, and he chose to sacrifice the people who, to him, were currently alive, to bring us back. And we were happy to support him in that after we found out.

This, interestingly, was basically the plot of the Wings of the Goddess expansion for FFXI. The world was doomed to a bitter stalemate in the war against the Shadowlord. The Goddess of Vana'diel, Altana, couldn't stand the suffering, and so influenced things so that an extraordinarily unlikely timeline, one in which the Shadowlord was slain, became the TRUE timeline. However, the original timeline still existed, and the "heroes" within it (closer to embittered anti-heroes, forced to make sacrifice after sacrifice for generations just to keep the Shadowlord at bay) couldn't bear the idea that all their hard work and suffering had been for nothing. Worse, an entity called Atomos existed, whose entire purpose was to devour superfluous timelines, and it was possible that theirs would be on the menu. They became determined to take their rightful place in the timeline, Altana be damned, and used time travel to set what went right wrong again.

I personally thought it was fantastic to see a plotline seriously address the question of what happens to the original timeline when you muck about with time. WotG wasn't my favorite FFXI expansion, but I loved the story nonetheless.

In the case of the Exarch, though, there was no stalemate. what they were facing was the gradual end of days. If it was an ongoing struggle for survival, it was one they were LOSING. It's certainly possible that the survivors decided that their own lives were less important than ensuring a timeline was created where none of that happened in the first place. Not too unlike the voluntary sacrifices by the Ancients to bring Zodiark about to save them!

[Alleo]

The days prior to the Sundering were ones of monstrous act after monstrous act being performed under circumstances where pretty much every conceivable course of action was a bad one. Summoning Zodiark and the methods for doing so were unconscionable, and yet at the same time I can't really fault the Council for doing so (at least, at our current understanding of the situation).

I do wonder if we ever learn that summoning Zodiark truly was the only option at that time or if maybe some (including the 14th) had other ways to do it without the need to create such a being. At least I would hope that the 14th did not just leave their ranks without at least pointing out other ways. Why I do believe that? Well our characters and the scions have a way to find other paths that lead to less destruction or none at all. Maybe some of those Ancient ones even warned about the consequences, maybe some even tried to help before the calamity was at Amaurots door.

Of course when its at the door summoning Zodiark might have been the only way and at least those that went out, went out willingly. (Of course it is interesting that Zodiarks summoners needed others to sacrifice themselves while Hydealyn summoners seemingly used their own life for it. Already quite a difference imo) So I dont necessarily blame them for it. But anything after that, when everything was restored was the Ascians faults and were not necessary at all. They were pure selfish acts. They were ready to plan the murder of all the future generations of the new life.

I remain curious if we ever get to know why they choose the sundering. Of course one reason could be that Zodiark was much too strong and in a way much to integrated into the planet to destroy him. But maybe they had to do it to stop any future calamity from happening again. Maybe those that summoned her found out more about the sound and what started it, maybe they realized how terrible wrong such a huge power can be, especially after all the death and destruction the people had seen and thus this was another reason on why they somehow gave her the power to split the essence of everything. (I doubt that this happened on pure luck)

For me at least the choice was between letting everyone that will be born die or take away their memories and split their power but at least give them a chance to live a life. The latter might not have been the best decision too but I dont see it as murder at all.

@RopeDrink:

Ah it seems that I have misunderstood your other post then. It sounded more like people seeing it as bad are wrong about it but now I understand your points better.

And yes I can understand Emets pain and even though I disagree with Alisaie that they might have done the same in their place I can see where they come from but at the same time the more I knew the more I had a hard time holding onto that sympathy. They saved the world thanks to Zodiark and the big amount of sacrifice and then afterwards suddenly did not want to accept that. And as far as we know they only wanted those Amaurotines back, not all the others that they did not help and that died before that too. (Seemingly also ancient ones) If the story had told us that the spoken races came from out of space after that calamity and together with Hydealyn killed of the last Ancient ones and sundered the stars then I could quite understand their actions more (but as you said, this still does not change the fact that the people now are not at fault for this) but the Ancients ones were still there. They still could have risen again. Their planet was save and full of life again. But instead they only held onto the past and of course only on those that also lived in Amaurot. And then it was other Ancient ones that said: No, enough is enough.

I just wonder: Would they have gone the same way if they had not been tempered?