If SCH got Energy Drain back, why not do the same for WHMs?

[Hereon]

I don't think it would be "massively" overpowered, since even if you're nurturing the Blood Lily in the process, you still have to deal with the fact those same GCDs could be spent on, say, Glare (or even a rank of Stone, depending on the level in which the dump spell is introduced).
But having it not build the Blood Lily is still something worth considering, even if seemingly counterproductive.

The Problem here is that every Lily spent working towards misery is allready worth 225 potency. Even something like a 80 potency offensive lily + building towards the blood lily would be stronger than casting glare. Which would kind of defeat the whole point of the new lily system in generall since it is suppose to give you something in return for not doing dmg. Whoever i like the idea of a buff that has been floating around now. or maybe just go the MP route and give the targeted player some MP back at the cost of a lily. allthough whm himself doesnt struggle to much, it would give whm some sort of support for other healers and casters.

[galbsadi]

I don't think WHM needs a DPS or MP restore lily dump.

For one, there's no penalty for holding lilies (whereas for SCH there's effectively a MP penalty b/c we don't generate MP from Assiz...er, Fey Blessing/Indom, and we don't have something like Thin Air.

Second, we don't get Afflatus:Miser...er, Fey Lazerz for using 3 Aetherflow stacks. Even if we burn all of our Aetherflow on ED, it's nowhere near the DPS of Afflatus:Misery (and I'm not saying it should be, don't get me wrong).

I do think WHM needs 2 QOL changes, though:

1.) Make the Afflatus healing spells oGCD. You might need a CD on Afflatus:Rapture to make that viable, and you might need to adjust the potency a bit on Afflatus:Solace (say down to 600pot)...but that'd go a long way towards fixing the clunkiness.

2.) Give WHM something like Excogitation as an Afflatus spell. It fits the 'pure healer' narrative, gives a use of Afflatus during downtime, and overall would be a good move.

[Archwizard]

Make the Afflatus healing spells oGCD. You might need a CD on Afflatus:Rapture to make that viable, and you might need to adjust the potency a bit on Afflatus:Solace (say down to 600pot)...but that'd go a long way towards fixing the clunkiness.

So... I strongly disagree with this.

I don't think the "clunkiness" is necessarily the fact that we have GCD heals other than Cure. Fact is the only instant tool WHM has aside from the Afflatus skills is Aero/Dia, which makes movement a particular weakness and makes it more difficult to weave other oGCD skills between Stone casts. Turning the only instant GCD heal effects we have into oGCDs will diminish their value and take away a tool to cycle the GCD on the move.

Further, giving us two oGCD heals tied to the Lilies would just be jarring compared to the half-dozen that were removed from Lilies with Shadowbringers. It makes them seem sort of... arbitrary, especially when we have Tetragrammaton.

[Vitreus]

I have no idea why we can't get Aetherflow out of combat. Was this a balance change? It's so frustrating

[Billythepancake]

I have no idea why we can't get Aetherflow out of combat. Was this a balance change? It's so frustrating

Only reason it happened was so teams weren't waiting on SCH/SMN to have it back off CD before they pull a boss in raid, but many many people have suggested better solutions to this problem. SE just used the laziest one.

[Vitreus]

Only reason it happened was so teams weren't waiting on SCH/SMN to have it back off CD before they pull a boss in raid, but many many people have suggested better solutions to this problem. SE just used the laziest one.

Is that the same reason they changed the astro cards as well?

[Billythepancake]

Is that the same reason they changed the astro cards as well?

The astro cards is moreso from hardcore raiders only ever wanting balance, and wanting every card they drew to just be balance. They got what they wanted, at the expense of many many AST mains out there.

[Vitreus]

The astro cards is moreso from hardcore raiders only ever wanting balance, and wanting every card they drew to just be balance. They got what they wanted, at the expense of many many AST mains out there.

I was unclear, meant cards not applying their seal arcana out of combat. The buff will still go into effect but the other half of the effect to build up to divination won't.

[Ardox]

I don't think WHM needs a DPS or MP restore lily dump.

For one, there's no penalty for holding lilies (whereas for SCH there's effectively a MP penalty b/c we don't generate MP from Assiz...er, Fey Blessing/Indom, and we don't have something like Thin Air.

Second, we don't get Afflatus:Miser...er, Fey Lazerz for using 3 Aetherflow stacks. Even if we burn all of our Aetherflow on ED, it's nowhere near the DPS of Afflatus:Misery (and I'm not saying it should be, don't get me wrong).

I do think WHM needs 2 QOL changes, though:

1.) Make the Afflatus healing spells oGCD. You might need a CD on Afflatus:Rapture to make that viable, and you might need to adjust the potency a bit on Afflatus:Solace (say down to 600pot)...but that'd go a long way towards fixing the clunkiness.

2.) Give WHM something like Excogitation as an Afflatus spell. It fits the 'pure healer' narrative, gives a use of Afflatus during downtime, and overall would be a good move.

So put 4 charges on Tetragrammaton, 2 charges on Assize and get rid of lilies? But with what will you weave those oGCD with Glare needin refresh only every 30 sec?

[Ardox]

I was unclear, meant cards not applying their seal arcana out of combat. The buff will still go into effect but the other half of the effect to build up to divination won't.

Yeap, it so we couldn't prepare a divination before pulling the boss.