SCH Preparing for Eden Savage

[ZezekuZeku]

My static is diving into savage tomorrow and I went to the striking dummy to test myself when I realized, is there any reason the healer dummy tests our damage and not our healing? I feel like it would be better to have healer dummies take damage and we have to keep it alive, especially if they want healers to play a more pure healing role compared to before. Given ilvl requirements, I assume a gear check isn't that necessary, and it wouldn't help you fine tune piety stat anyways. Maybe I'm missing something, but is there even a point?

[Lagomorph]

Healer striking dummy test is just as dumb as it seems, unfortunately. There's not really any point to doing it aside from testing what your maximum dps output when not using a single heal is.

[Sebazy]

Simply requiring you to bomb heals on a dummy would be arguably even less relevant than the current dummies are to anything this game actually has to offer TBH. Combining this with mechanics and forced movement would make this much more relevant to actual gameplay, but that's far beyond the scope of SSS and more in line of the Gold Saucer game I suggested on these boards years back.

Note that this early during the progression cycle, you will progressively get required to contribute an increasing amount of damage as you go through the turns to ensure you don't get caught out by enrage. This whole 'SE wants us to play a pure healing role' thing is just drivel at this point and I really don't understand what's still fuelling it. If SE wants us to heal, where are the healing checks? Dungeons are still a DPS face roll. EX Primal healing requirements are literally a bad joke and I'd argue that 2 of the 4 Savage turns are merely a passable one.

[LariaKirin]

Healer or DPS, it does not and can not to prepare you for the fight. How could a stationary dummy ever do that?

The purpose of the dummy is to check your DPS against a requirement roughly similar to that of the fight.

Note that this early during the progression cycle, you will progressively get required to contribute an increasing amount of damage as you go through the turns to ensure you don't get caught out by enrage. This whole 'SE wants us to play a pure healing role' thing is just drivel at this point and I really don't understand what's still fuelling it. If SE wants us to heal, where are the healing checks? Dungeons are still a DPS face roll. EX Primal healing requirements are literally a bad joke and I'd argue that 2 of the 4 Savage turns are merely a passable one.

You and many others are perpetuating this misunderstanding of "pure healing". The context for this has been in terms of shield healing vs direct (pure) healing. It had nothing to do with healing vs dps.

As for healing checks, there are healing checks. The entire fight is a healing check. Try not healing at all and see what happens.

Of course, that's not what you mean. You're talking about intense healing moments where a mistake causes a wipe. And there are those as well in Savage.

I don't understand this complaint. Once you've solved the mechanic (in this case incoming damage), of course it's easier. It's like saying the boss has no mechanics because you know the entire fight. Or like saying that the boss has no DPS check because you've overgeared the fight and optimized your movement and GCDs.

[Sebazy]

You and many others are perpetuating this misunderstanding of "pure healing". The context for this has been in terms of shield healing vs direct (pure) healing. It had nothing to do with healing vs dps.

Please quote where the OP mentions anything to do with shields?

I'm pretty confident that the whole pure healer movement is down to people thinking that SE doesn't want us to DPS. That is of course assuming that it's not a discussion about the merits of shields vs whatever else, which if I'm not mistaken, this isn't. Of course, the OP is welcome to correct me on this if I am wrong <3

You're talking about intense healing moments where a mistake causes a wipe. And there are those as well in Savage.

The thing is, until you hit E4S, they just aren't there. You only have to look at my logs to see that I'm a pretty awful habitual overhealer, especially during progression, yet I had almost no MP issues at all this tier because I just wasn't being taxed. E2S came a little close for me if I had to raise and the group mitigation wasn't great, but E1S and E3S were uneventful to say the least. Compare that to God Kefka progression where I was inhaling Ethers and riding my MCH's foot if Bishop was more than a few ticks late.

SE's done some good encounters that have really pushed healers in the past. Other than Titan, these turns won't be joining that list in my book.

[LariaKirin]

Please quote where the OP mentions anything to do with shields?

I'm pretty confident that the whole pure healer movement is down to people thinking that SE doesn't want us to DPS. That is of course assuming that it's not a discussion about the merits of shields vs whatever else, which if I'm not mistaken, this isn't. Of course, the OP is welcome to correct me on this if I am wrong <3

I'm saying that SE does want us to DPS. The entire pure healer nonsense you see around is the result of a misunderstanding of what SE said.

The thing is, until you hit E4S, they just aren't there. You only have to look at my logs to see that I'm a pretty awful habitual overhealer, especially during progression, yet I had almost no MP issues at all this tier because I just wasn't being taxed. E2S came a little close for me if I had to raise and the group mitigation wasn't great, but E1S and E3S were uneventful to say the least. Compare that to God Kefka progression where I was inhaling Ethers and riding my MCH's foot if Bishop was more than a few ticks late.

SE's done some good encounters that have really pushed healers in the past. Other than Titan, these turns won't be joining that list in my book.

I've not done Godka when it was relevant, but what you should compare is Godka vs Titan, not vs first fights.
You emphasize MP issues. Is that what constitutes a healing check to you?

E1S does have healing checks in Vice and Virtue phases. They are pretty lenient because it's the first fight of a first tier.
E3S is more of a positioning fight. But there are some checks when parties separate, due to separating the two parts of the healing kit. Black Smokers phase especially (assuming you bait the puddles), there's quite a bit to pay attention to when healing.
E4S I won't comment until we get farther into it.

E2S:
Hell Wind is a single target healing check. 5 seconds to heal up two targets.
Double flares:
- 6 seconds between flares and party stack with 1 healer separated.
- puddles into immediate cleaver (party separated)

Just because you pass the healing checks, does not mean they are not there.

[EaMett]

You emphasize MP issues. Is that what constitutes a healing check to you?

I mean, it's not like you can't give the party 100% hp in the span of a gcd. All that's left is really how long you can sustain high HPS. Hence mana.


To the OP, the reason they don't test you for healing is because there is little healing to be done in the content. At most you'll be tested on how to split the healing with your co-healer, not how much healing you can do.

[Alphras]

Please quote where the OP mentions anything to do with shields?

I'm pretty confident that the whole pure healer movement is down to people thinking that SE doesn't want us to DPS. That is of course assuming that it's not a discussion about the merits of shields vs whatever else, which if I'm not mistaken, this isn't. Of course, the OP is welcome to correct me on this if I am wrong <3.

There was a quote from Yoshi about SCHs focusing too much on shielding and leaving the healing to the other healer (which was already completely false). This was mistranslated as SCHs focusing too much on dps and relying too much on the other healer.

The thing is, until you hit E4S, they just aren't there.

E2S has very real healing checks. Try that fight with inexperienced healers and you wipe quite a few times there.

You only have to look at my logs to see that I'm a pretty awful habitual overhealer, especially during progression, yet I had almost no MP issues at all this tier because I just wasn't being taxed.

This could just as well be a WHM thing. WHM mp management is off the charts this expansion.

[LariaKirin]

I mean, it's not like you can't give the party 100% hp in the span of a gcd. All that's left is really how long you can sustain high HPS. Hence mana.

Yes, you can blow a bunch of resources and burst 0-100 if you really want to. What's your point?

Again, just because you pass the healing checks, does not mean they are not there.

[Sebazy]

Last week I'd have agreed with you on the E2S checks, but that turned out to be mostly down to a bad week 1 strat for flares that my group adopted. We switched to a better positioning method this week and it literally trivialised the healing part of that section.