[SPOILERS]Considering that new Minfilia feature.

[Antoine_Lenheim]

I'm sorry, again your reasoning doesn't gel up and at this point you're just shifting goal posts.

It just seems that you didnt understand the true meaning of my words. I have to explain myself here. Yes, I tend to exaggerate my words to give them a greater emotional color because in Internet communication very often there is not enough that, umm, emotional tint, because we don’t hear each other and don’t understand with what tone we speak one or another phrase. Thats exactly why I said that in such confident tone that they will never admit their mistakes. But of course I meant only this exact situation, that to admit that it was their fault in that poor writing of Minfilia would mean to recognize failure of a huge chunk of work and man hours and people would expect them to rectify the situation by adding more lines, more "mass" to Minfilia's interaction with a player. They just decided not not to add more work on the plate to themselves and took the easy way out by bringing her out of the story, Im still not convinced that it wasnt the true reason behind this.

So yeah, I didnt mean that they did not and will not accept their mistakes at all, yes, there were fine examples of it and links that you attached confirm this. But really, its hard not to accept that translation errors (and more importantly, inability to provide the same experience to people from different cultural backgrounds) were really their own mistakes, especially when a lot of people found them out and raised a discussion. They just had no other way out but to fix them. But with Minfilia they had a few ways out. And they took one of them.

Hating one character is not a good reason to skip the cutscenes and dialogue, tbh, especially considering how much interest in the story you claim to have. I didn't like Moenbryda, I still watched those cutscenes. I didn't like that bastard brother of Yotsuyu's, I still watched those cutscenes. I *initially* didn't like Thancred (forgive me for my sins, I have long since learned) but I still watched any cutscene with him. Basically speaking, if you're interested in the story, you won't skip just because one character you don't like is involved. Why? *Because they are a part of the story, and in this case a particularly key part of the story*

First of all, I didnt skip all of main story because of Ryne, I skipped only those bits in which Ryne took the most prominient role. Thankfully, after what happened in Amh Araeng, Ryne started to appear lesser and lesser and I managed to watch cutscenes almost in their entirety. And yes, you have all the rights to claim that I didnt have any interest in the story at all but the truth is, I did and did big time, ShB story was actually on par with HW pre-Dragonsong War story for me in terms of writing (Archbishop, hassle with chantry etc -- loved it), I loved absolutely all concepts of it. I just didnt like Ryne more. From the point she was introduced, then after it was made known that there can only be either Ryne or Minfilia my dislike for her spiked up cuz I knew old Minfilia wont win and in the end grew to hatred after Minfilia gave up on her life for that girl, hatred that made me consider skipping cutscenes. I was super interested in the story but at the same time, didnt want to accept that Ryne is a part of in now. So I declared a boycott, as childish as it might sound. I just didnt want her to be a part of my story so I pretended shes not here at all by skipping all cutscenes in which she took the most prominent role. Yet I still managed to enjoy the story. Guess something is wrong with me, eh? Maybe you just didnt hate characters you mentioned as much as I hate Ryne now, I dont know.

And on point with Eden, since Ryne taking almost all of screentime there, I decided to rely on journal and maybe help from fellow forum dwellers who might be kind enough to provide me with the most important spoilers about Eden's plot since again, I did read that it will shed some light on Minfilia's doings in the past and I was interested in them but they didnt made it known that Ryne will be a major NPC in it. Thats why I decided to sacrifice cutscenes in favor of text information. And why would I even ask for information then if I had no interest in the story like you say?

[EdwinLi]

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Not to be rude but...

It seems your hatred is just more born from wanting to blame someone for Minfilia's death.

It is in some way very similar to Emit's personality when it came to trying to bring back the Ancients of the past that sacrificed their own life by their own choice for the future of the planet.

You are putting too much expectations on Ryne to be the sacrifice to bring back Minfilia because you only care about Minfilia and ignore Ryne because she is not Minfilia similar to Emit ignore the currrent life of the Planets because they are not the Ancients. You can't let go like Emit because you only see the Ancients as they once were just like how you see Minfilia as she once was when you look at Ryne. You can't accept Ryne as a new life that was given a chance to live her own path by Minfilia's own choice to sacrifice her life (which she had already made long ago through the 100 years of sacrificing past generations of Minfilias by taking over their bodies and killing their souls) similar to how Emite refuse to accept the current life despite it was the choice of the Ancients to sacrifice their own life to Zodiark for the future generations of the world to have their own path.

At this point I think you really need to reconsider why you want to continue the story because it seem the only way for you to ever accept Ryne as a part of the Main Characters now is if they magically bring back Minfilia (which may or may not happen in a future storyline) or at least bring her back alive but still provide a lore reason why she never shows up again such as remain the Avatar of Hydaelyn or become the new Hydaelyn of the Planet if current Hydaelyn dies.

[Antoine_Lenheim]

It is in some way very similar to Emit's personality when it came to trying to bring back the Ancients of the past that sacrificed their own life by their own choice for the future of the planet.

Yeah, I actually mentioned earlier that Im sympathetic to Ascians in this expansion and would take their side if we werent on a different side of a barricade. I explain myself more in this post.

At this point I think you really need to reconsider why you want to continue the story

Because it unlocks Expert Roulette :P

[QT_Melon]

I understood the true meaning, but you do have to realize that to some you may be coming off a bit obsessive? I don't see how you thought that contributed to a civil discussion, when people were doing that on their own. The difference being is that people were being objective with their opinions even if they did or did not like a character. There were some that weren't but even then for the most part it still had nothing to do with you in particular. It has to do with people being more analytical about why or why not they felt something worked.

[Hezzlocks]

First of all, I didnt skip all of main story because of Ryne, I skipped only those bits in which Ryne took the most prominient role.

I never said you skipped it all. I simply stated that hating one character is no reason to skip cutscenes. I didn't like a few characters but I watched their cutscenes regardless.

In fact, skipping cutscenes because it features one specific character, and one that is so vitally integral to the story no less, is in fact being very disrespectful of the character, the story and the writer as well. You essentially did not give Ryne any kind of chance to prove herself, you did not give the story a chance to promote her, and you did not give the writer a chance to flesh her out and make her into a worthy successor. All because you couldn't get over your obsession for Minfilia, despite the fact that her story in Shadowbringers was beautiful and a very fitting and satisfying conclusion to her story, something many characters never get to have. And considering how many people either didn't care about her or didn't like her at all before, it's wonderful she got to have such a conclusion at all!

Bloody hell, even Thancred was able to accept this

[EdwinLi]

Bloody hell, even Thancred was able to accept this

To be fair, Thancred did have 5 years to accept this will be the result in the end and most likely only started to accept Ryne around 1 or 2 years after finding the truth. We only known Ryne for a few days/weeks/months.

Still, Ryne is still young and needs time to grow. She is basically like Alphanaud in 2.0 to 2.X right now with her life, young and still a bit ignorant of the world due to being locked away for so long and not having a chance to be her own person until now. Though Alphinaud was just young and too optimisticly ignorant thus people hated him with a passion during 2.0 to 2.X just like how Antoine hates Ryne right now and yes there were people who skipped cutscenes that would heavily involve Alphinaud due to how much he annoyed them only to finally stop that habbit once 3.0 got released due to his development in personality and beliefs.

Ryne needs time to grow as a character into her own which is part of the story that will certainly begin in 5.1 and from there we can only watch and see who she becomes to a point people will finally accept her as a different person from Minfilia and also not someone trying to replace Minfilia.

[TankHunter678]

Ryne needs time to grow as a character into her own which is part of the story that will certainly begin in 5.1 and from there we can only watch and see who she becomes to a point people will finally accept her as a different person from Minfilia and also not someone trying to replace Minfilia.

Thing is though that Ryne started to develop into her own person after Minfilia gave her control of her life. She was not trying to replace Minfilia, she was trying to become her own person with agency over her own life which is part of why she chose to face Minfilia and share the choice she had made. The entire raid story begins and follows her own desire to begin reclaiming what was lost to the flood.

The way things sound Antione is not even giving her a chance, and is skipping all of her character development. Unlike Alphinaud who took a long time to get over his faults Ryne is proceeding fairly fast in becoming her own person.

[Berethos]

I didn’t think she had much of a personality, nor did I find her particularly talented in anything other than getting kidnapped by every other villain out there.

I've always found this issue a bit odd...

Considering she was only nabbed twice - once when everyone not killed when Livia attacked the Waking Sands was also captured - this includes Tataru, Papalymo, AND Urianger and yet they get no crap for getting kidnapped nearly as much as Minfilia was (2 isn't exactly a hard number to reach afterall) - and then later when she refuses to hand over Tupsimati to Nabriales (he literally states that he'll just take her since she won't hand it over and Elidibus "would never let me hear the end of it" if he just killed her).

I mean, I think we get captured just about as much, now that I think about it.

Her story definitely isn't told well in ARR, but this "she just stands around and gets captured all the time" kind of view of her just doesn't feel like it stands up to any sort of scrutiny, and there are bigger problems worth criticizing from her portrayal and narrative prior to ShB.

[QT_Melon]

I think the capturing one is more of the sense of what she was doing or where she was at, than the fact she just got captured. If people are captured or kidnapped during missions or doing something useful (at least to the eyes of the audience) they will waive it.

[Berethos]

I think the capturing one is more of the sense of what she was doing or where she was at, than the fact she just got captured. If people are captured or kidnapped during missions or doing something useful (at least to the eyes of the audience) they will waive it.

Tataru, Papalymo, and Urianger are also captured...while not on a mission, or really doing anything more or less useful than Minfilia was doing at the time, and like her whatever they were doing at the time was shown off-screen. Yet it's Minfilia that gets the grief for being captured, and Minfilia alone in this situation.

The other time she was protecting a valuable and powerful relic, despite not having really having the power to do so (and lucked out a bit that Elidibus wanted her alive for some reason and so Nabriales couldn't straight up kill her and take it).

Nah...I don't think they are taking into account what the person was doing, it's just a matter of if they like the character or not, not what happened in the narrative.