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  1. #31
    Player
    Ardox's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2015
    Posts
    270
    Character
    Kaleth Orebiter
    World
    Hyperion
    Main Class
    Lancer Lv 80
    Quote Originally Posted by TankHunter678 View Post
    The Theory works like this:

    With 4 Healers you can design healers around pairs and break up their healing types. You can have Sustained, Burst, Mitigation, and Utility designs which each would want a different kind of co-healer.

    A sustained healer would pair up well with a mitigation healer, a utility healer pairs up well with a burst healer.

    A sustained healer paired up with a burst healer would mean less opportunities for the burst healer allowing them to DPS more and if shit hits the fan they got all of their options ready.

    A mitigation healer paired with a utility healer could result in compounded mitigation, making what healing that is going out more effective even if the raw numbers are not as high.

    So on and so forth. It changes the dynamics around. Of course there would still be a top 1% meta, nothing you can really do about that. Though things can be more easily shaken up by improving the pair that is on the lower end.
    The problem is you need to have a way for the jobs not to walk on each other toes: What if you get 2 Burst? Will their mana melt because they can sustain as well? How much can you unbalance pure homogeneity before it gets unplayable? Trust me, if the solution was that easy, the developers would have take it
    (0)

  2. #32
    Player Yuyuka3's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2015
    Location
    Gridania
    Posts
    486
    Character
    Kyara Moonbane
    World
    Shiva
    Main Class
    White Mage Lv 100
    *opens duty finder*
    2x healers in need, rest tank...
    (0)

  3. #33
    Player
    Kabooa's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Posts
    4,391
    Character
    Jace Ossura
    World
    Gilgamesh
    Main Class
    Goldsmith Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Yuyuka3 View Post
    *opens duty finder*
    2x healers in need, rest tank...
    Guess that boycott didn't work out.
    (1)

  4. #34
    Player
    Deceptus's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Location
    The Goblet - 16th Ward, Plot 55
    Posts
    4,418
    Character
    Deceptus Keelon
    World
    Behemoth
    Main Class
    Sage Lv 90
    Quote Originally Posted by Kabooa View Post
    Guess that boycott didn't work out.
    First month was nothing but heals in need. There wasn't a boycott, but there was an extreme shortage of healers.

    Even when it does say something other than healer (say tank), I've queued as a tank and had a 5m wait. Switched to heals, instant pop.

    The system isn't 100% accurate.
    (11)
    Veteran healers don't care if we need to heal, but right now we don't. We want interesting things to do during the downtime other than a 30s dot and a single filler spell that hasn't changed from lvl 4 to lvl 90.
    Dead DPS do no DPS. Raised DPS do 25/50% lower DPS. Do the mechanics and don't stand in bad stuff.
    Other games expect basic competence, FFXIV is pleasantly surprised by it. Other games have toxic elitism. FFXIV has toxic casualism.[/LIST]

  5. #35
    Player
    Impurrrsive's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2013
    Location
    Gridania
    Posts
    121
    Character
    Coleo Softpaw
    World
    Masamune
    Main Class
    Scholar Lv 80
    Adding new healer will only increase the number only for a short period of time, the cycle will repeat again if the healer not properly balanced. Since majority will be another healer change job to another healer. The number will be the same if not decreasing
    I would say balance the current healers there eventho the future may seems bleak
    (1)

  6. #36
    Player
    Gaethan_Tessula's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2019
    Location
    Gridania
    Posts
    222
    Character
    Gaethan Tessula
    World
    Adamantoise
    Main Class
    Blue Mage Lv 70
    Quote Originally Posted by MaraD_ View Post
    They said the same thing about healers and tanks before, and yet added a 4th tank. Yoshida even said he looked at making DNC a healer, and decided DPS was more interesting. (He also shows stubbornness in certain ways, when it comes to going against the normal, such as healers in aiming gear)
    He wouldnt have even considered DNC as a healer, if he truly felt there shouldnt be a 4th healer.

    If anything, I think he MOSTLY designed DNC as a healer, but with so many issues that cropped up, they tried to salvage it, by making it a DPS.
    Controller users need to press up/down to target party members, upwards of a maximum of 4 times. So GCDs cant be too short. (we have no 2s GCD healer for example) oGCDs cant be too many either. So DNC steps were put on the GCD to counter this. But now they as a healer, have to rely on oGCD to heal during steps.... but that goes back to, "too many button inputs for controller users". This is most likely why they scrapped DNC as a healer, despite being the only DPS with a rather in depth heal option, and even quest line referencing their heals, despite being such a minor thing about their actual role.
    Why do they think controller is incapable of doing these things? If I can do combos in Guilty Gear on controller, I can rapidly downtab and hit 1 oGCD per second on one too.

    Nor do I get the obsession with limiting buttons to fit on two X-bars. Three seems like a perfectly managable number, esp. when using a W-bar setup or putting more situational abilities on the 3rd X-bar.
    (1)

  7. #37
    Player
    MaraD_'s Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2019
    Posts
    290
    Character
    Hede Devaul
    World
    Mateus
    Main Class
    Fisher Lv 80
    Quote Originally Posted by Gaethan_Tessula View Post
    Why do they think controller is incapable of doing these things?
    Its not that they are incapable of it.
    Just that SE has made comments about rappid button mashing before. (Such as needing to press a button before every attack on GNB, to match the FF8 trigger system, and how that would lead to tendentious.
    Then things like remaking DRK to lose DA.

    Based on when they were making DNC in the middle of SB, some point they changed their mind on button mashing. My assumption being most likely due to DRK players who liked HW DRK, but didnt like SB DRK.
    (Then again, they also slowed down MNK in SB, rather than after, so who knows. but they did mention the desire to slow them down still for SH.)

    I think there should be high APM jobs in all 3 roles. (and all sub roles)
    Just pick the role u like, and pick the speed you like.
    In short, I think there should be a 2s GCD healer.
    But I doubt SE is going to make one.
    (1)

  8. #38
    Player
    Sloprano's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2014
    Posts
    282
    Character
    Quilia Labro
    World
    Cerberus
    Main Class
    Scholar Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Impurrrsive View Post
    Adding new healer will only increase the number only for a short period of time, the cycle will repeat again if the healer not properly balanced. Since majority will be another healer change job to another healer. The number will be the same if not decreasing
    I would say balance the current healers there eventho the future may seems bleak
    There was mentioned somewhere that SE said they released Dark Knight in Heavensward in an attempt to get more players to play tanks. Instead what they saw after the initial rush to try out jobs mostly those who played tank before stayed as tank and total number was more or less the same. That might happen again now with Gunbreaker after people have gotten it to 80 and might've happend if we had gotten a new healer.

    It's certainly tricky, I don't even know if rebalancing Healers to be more interesting through unique damage, downtime and healing gameplay would make people flock to them. What might work is them try to impress those already playing healers so that they might share with others on the fence how fun it is to play. Confirming to someone who just unlocked Scholar that they only have Ruin and Bio II for 50 levels haven't inspired much enthusiasm so far. Indeed, they could use summoner on the side, but I don't think AST and WHM have any more alternatives.
    (3)

  9. #39
    Player
    Jandor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Location
    Ul'dah
    Posts
    3,479
    Character
    Tal Young
    World
    Cerberus
    Main Class
    Gunbreaker Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Yuyuka3 View Post
    *opens duty finder*
    2x healers in need, rest tank...
    Quote Originally Posted by Kabooa View Post
    Guess that boycott didn't work out.
    2x healer in need is 2x more than it was before.
    (5)

  10. #40
    Player
    Kabooa's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Posts
    4,391
    Character
    Jace Ossura
    World
    Gilgamesh
    Main Class
    Goldsmith Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Jandor View Post
    2x healer in need is 2x more than it was before.
    Sure, but from my experience as a DPS queuing, aside from the first few days of early access where DPS queues -were nearly instant- (On Aether at least), Queue times are quite normal.

    While 'healer in need' implies the tank and healer ratios are off with more tanks than healers, the difference is not so astronomical that DPS queues have been negatively impacted. It might be unacceptable to a tank to wait more than 5 seconds for a queue, but them's the breaks.
    (0)

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