Square Enix, please think about both Casual AND Hardcore crafters..

[CookiesNCreams]

That's fair. I apologize.

As for what I would do, without revamping the crafting system, I'd just add special glamours to specialist recipes that had absurd number requirements. NQ grants you a model, HQ grants you a glowy effect unique to said model. Fancy as our outfits can be, sometimes a little bit more sparkle would be appreciated.

The system is too two dimensional to ever have any real difficulty to it, and needs additional facets to actually be challenging.

Well, at least we are on the same page now, haha. I’m sure they can come up with a way to make crafting harder. But not only apply it to glam, but end game gear as well. (Notice I said gear, not mats) It is SO rewarding to know you HQ’d a craft after spending so many hours grinding crafting, and learning rotation moves. Especially when the craft is super difficult.

*How dare people who don't want to invest time or effort be allowed to obtain every bit as much as I do, ruining what I enjoy in the process.

It’s sad that I have to agree with this statement. Yoshida should really be notified of this thread, come the next live letter. And I personally will not stop until it is answered in a live letter.

[Kabooa]

*How dare people who don't want to invest time or effort be allowed to obtain every bit as much as I do, ruining what I enjoy in the process.

See, it's comments like this where it shows it's not really about difficulty.

[CookiesNCreams]

See, it's comments like this where it shows it's not really about difficulty.

I think what Nixxe is trying to say, is that there should be a barrier that separates the two players: the no-life players VS the players that are on the casual side. When there is no barrier, it means the players on the casual side can get the same rewards as the no life players.

That’s usually not how online video games work. When I used to play call of duty a lot, I spent hours and even weeks trying to farm Headshots to get all golden guns. Where I eventually got diamond guns as a compensation. Very rewarding. It showed that the developers appreciate the no life players that really enjoyed their game. That goes for other MMOs as well...can’t say the same for WoW though, lol. Maybe. FPS, TPS, MMOs, they have all had a barrier. But FFXIV for some reason does not.

In FFXIV’s case, Prudent Touch, Preparatory Touch, and Delicate Synthesis....along with no hardcore challenges and rewards...is like telling your no life players to : “get lost, and go somewhere else. we only care for our casual players. you no life players can piss off” basically.

Me personally, I would like to know the FFXIV development team’s reasoning for that. Depending on their answer, I may unfortunately end my subscription. I really loved this game. The simple solution would be to cater to BOTH types of players. Not favor one over the other. We BOTH deserve content and compassion. This “casual vs hardcore” war needs to stop, and can be easily solved with Yoshida listening to us both, instead of silencing one crowd, and listening to only the other.

And that, is what I am trying to argue here.

[Nixxe]

See, it's comments like this where it shows it's not really about difficulty.

I never suggested otherwise. Crafting in this game isn't about difficulty and couldn't really be made to be about difficulty without a drastic overhaul; it's about resource investment, in particular time. I laid out my thoughts on the subject on page 4. Simply put though, putting more time and effort into crafting should give me something to show for it as it has in the past, but SE seems determined to make sure that's not the case.

[Kabooa]

In FFXIV’s case, Prudent Touch, Preparatory Touch, and Delicate Synthesis....along with no hardcore challenges and rewards...is like telling your no life players to : “get lost, and go somewhere else. we only care for our casual players. you no life players can piss off” basically.

It's a simple matter of what gives the most bang for the buck.

One could make the argument that Savage, Ultimate, and Extremes aren't content consumed by everyone, but they are content that dips its fingers in to drive things in every area. It gives relevancy to gear and consumble crafting which in turn drives gathering, which generates maps, which garners glamour materials, which feeds back into crafting, etc etc.

Using your example specifically, I doubt those diamond guns provided any real advantage (AKA They're Glamours).

And frankly if you come from this angle, I have no truck against it. You want a fancy ass diamond studded saw with automatic teeth realiagnment that you have to grind out 20,000 HQ masterwork items for, by god, I'm all for it. You do you.

I personally wouldn't do it, but then, I'm not the hardcore crafter. And, as long as it's just exclusive glamours, I think you'll find a lot less resistance to this. Be them fancy achievement items, or absurdly numerical crafts, or somethin that you can't macro your way through.

The moment it becomes mechanical though, that's when the gloves come off.

[Lemuel81]

Sounds to me that if they eliminate the macros from the game, that would make crafting hard for people?

More tedious

[Nixxe]

The moment it becomes mechanical though, that's when the gloves come off.

What's wrong with mechanical advantages in an area of the game where stratification is based entirely on deciding to put effort into it or not? Nobody can be locked out of it unless they choose to be locked out of it.

[Kabooa]

What's wrong with mechanical advantages in an area of the game where stratification is based entirely on deciding to put effort into it or not? Nobody can be locked out of it unless they choose to be locked out of it.

Nobody chooses to have spare time for it. You either have the time, or you don't, and while this isn't an issue if the "advantage" itself exists in its own vacuum each tier, the bigger issue is whether or not it leads to more gatekeeping.

You want your +20 ilvl crafter gear, sure fine, I don't care.

Oh wait, we need that +20 ilvl crafted gear to make X, Y, Z and they aren't -glamour only- items? Then we have a problem.

[Nixxe]

Nobody chooses to have spare time for it. You either have the time, or you don't, and while this isn't an issue if the "advantage" itself exists in its own vacuum each tier, the bigger issue is whether or not it leads to more gatekeeping.

You want your +20 ilvl crafter gear, sure fine, I don't care.

Oh wait, we need that +20 ilvl crafted gear to make X, Y, Z and they aren't -glamour only- items? Then we have a problem.

Um... so what? People may not have the spare time for Savage or Ultimate. Does that mean it's not OK to have Savage and Ultimate? Some people may not even have enough time to level to 80. Do we need to get rid of levels? Why should the entire playerbase have to suffer because you can't stand the idea that someone who puts more time and effort into a game may get something you don't? Why should my ability to get something out of the game be limited by your free time? The game should always seek to first and foremost take care of people who actually have the time to play it.

[Kabooa]

The game should always seek to first and foremost take care of people who actually have the time to play it.

How much time qualifies for 'having the time to play it'?