Healer boycott in 5.0

[Kabooa]

Actually I'd argue that it was.

Very very few if any top flight healers will ever suggest that you should be blowing every GCD on damage. This is just bluster that's made up to justify this whole pointless argument.

So let me ask you which one gets telephoned worse.

"Keep your party alive. Everything else is bonus."

"Your GCDs are better put towards damage because your OGCDs are enough."

Further, all that guy said, essentially, is that good healers are good at managing their stuff. He wasn't the one firing off that the healers in question are 'bad' for playing one way or another. He might be insinuating they're on the wrong job (Ergo, "Green DPS" from "Healers with DPS"), but call them bad?

No. That came from the healer.

And it's not just with him. I've had discussions here, quite recently, where those involved flat out lie about their own capability because apparently if anyone admits to using a GCD heal, their opinion must be discredited because 'no one needs to use them'.

That attitude didn't come from a DPS or a Tank player. Most of us frankly don't care how you spend your downtime so long as we don't spend ours face down in the dirt from neglect.

[kidalutz]

That it is, and I think you have expanded many times why you feel that way, it's just a shame this person chooses to act like a goldfish in every thread he has been in.

We should focus on being constructive, I really think consolidating the information we have gathered amongst our own findings at launch is the best way to go forward, then we can give proper elucidated feedback on how we can improve the healer feel and gameplay as the expansion progresses and hopefully lead up to a well made 4th healer. Better late than never, it's about time we got the actual opinions on healers out not the "iz oki plz wait until out" like we have like Stormbloods Lilies etc.

This is what I've said for weeks all its gotten me has been We dont need to wait to post about it WE KNOW HOW IT WILL BE! to the point that frankly I'd be surprised if they even deign to listen to the feedback once its gathered unless people do it as dispassionately as possible.and just go with cold logic.

[Knoahl]

This is what I've said for weeks all its gotten me has been We dont need to wait to post about it WE KNOW HOW IT WILL BE! to the point that frankly I'd be surprised if they even deign to listen to the feedback once its gathered unless people do it as dispassionately as possible.and just go with cold logic.

I agree, it's just since the devs have said wait until its out until we give feedback, if we can give like a good thread after launch it's like our last ditch effort I suppose. It's just a shame we can't have just tested the game prior launch and actually have given them useful and constructive feedback, and... here I go repeating myself also haha

here is hopeing for a way forward in patches and the next expansion even if its a long road

[Sebazy]

<snip>

I'm fortunate enough to have co healed with, helped coach and been tutored by several of the very best healers to have played this game. I'm not going to lie, my (now ex, they switched to a DPS unsurprisingly) co healer is way beyond my talent, as are many of the other names I've had the fortune to raid with over the years. However, even when they've had to endure me at my worse (Meleeing Renaulds in SCOB on a trial is a real good start let me tell you), DPS has never once been the big overpowering agenda. Why? Because top flight healers know that your DPS will come naturally once you've got a handle on your active rate, awareness and understanding of an encounter.

If someone is trying to push a healer to do DPS when they don't have the reaction speed or judgement to safely do so then they are no less a fool than the person who insists that healers should be spamming cures from 20 yalms back.

That attitude didn't come from a DPS or a Tank player. Most of us frankly don't care how you spend your downtime so long as we don't spend ours face down in the dirt from neglect.

The problem is, just as there's a small but toxic minority that insist that all healers must DPS. There's a similarly small and equally toxic minority that insists that healers mustn't DPS.

There are countless examples on both sides of the camp, the extreme ends of the anti healer dps minority are especially frustrating as the classic examples I've seen and experienced first hand have usually exploded over very little and won't consider any form of reason to try and sway them to a more sensible position. The chat log screen cap from the Griffin I linked was just flabbergasting at the time and yet despite the fact that we as a group were failing DPS mechanics, this guy was dead set on the fact that our two wipes were caused by me DPSing. No recordings, logs or analysis was going to sway him.

This kind of fanatical attitude is becoming scarily prevalent, you only have to look at that awful debacle that happened on Twitch a day or two ago. Some of the clips leading up to that are just outright shameful.

And yes, I'll be the first to say that a healer who insists that every one spends all their GCDs throwing rocks without thought is just as short sighted as the examples I've listed above. Not everyone is capable of that. Not every situation is safe to do that.

A good healer will understand this, regardless of which side of the fence they are on.

[Shalan]

Sorry to butt in here -

This kind of fanatical attitude is becoming scarily prevalent, you only have to look at that awful debacle that happened on Twitch a day or two ago. Some of the clips leading up to that are just outright shameful.

Can anyone fill me in on this? I don't really use Twitch or really follow any influencers so I'm a bit lost as to what happened that's bad. Just a link or brief explanation would be nice to help follow along.

[Sebazy]

Can anyone fill me in on this? I don't really use Twitch or really follow any influencers so I'm a bit lost as to what happened that's bad. Just a link or brief explanation would be nice to help follow along.

TLDR: a tank took massive umbrage to a WHM DPSing a trash pull whilst streaming on Twitch to the point of various language proceeding to sitting there mid pull trying to vote kick them for cheating on stream. Further digging quickly showed that the guy had a pretty serious case of bad attitude towards healing in general. The popcorn only came in salted flavour that night.

Probably the biggest take away from all if it is how he made no attempt to ask the WHM what they were doing to either ask them to to tone it down more to his liking or even get a feel for if they had a handle on it as things where (which looked to be the situation in the clips). I don't particularly blame him for ignoring the sea of trolls that came after him, but it seemed clear that he was happy to remain completely ignorant of any enlightenment about the situation.

[Brandedblade]

That it is, and I think you have expanded many times why you feel that way, it's just a shame this person chooses to act like a goldfish in every thread he has been in.

We should focus on being constructive, I really think consolidating the information we have gathered amongst our own findings at launch is the best way to go forward, then we can give proper elucidated feedback on how we can improve the healer feel and gameplay as the expansion progresses and hopefully lead up to a well made 4th healer. Better late than never, it's about time we got the actual opinions on healers out not the "iz oki plz wait until out" like we have like Stormbloods Lilies etc.

Now that I've seen more of the posts. I think I have a better grasp of the situation. It's bad players misinterpreting the fact that good players being efficient with their gcds as "OMG I must dps as much as possible". What I was giving Sebazy a "goldfish" moment with was that the lack of context made it seem more like they where being arrogant. It sounds less so with the context and I'll apologize for that.

As for me, I'm still gonna be optimistic. I like playing the healers boring rotation and all and I've no issues defending that. Are there things they could improve on? Sure. But until then I guess I'm gonna chill in my fishbowl and be positive about what I got and what I'm getting.

[kidalutz]

I agree, it's just since the devs have said wait until its out until we give feedback, if we can give like a good thread after launch it's like our last ditch effort I suppose. It's just a shame we can't have just tested the game prior launch and actually have given them useful and constructive feedback, and... here I go repeating myself also haha

here is hopeing for a way forward in patches and the next expansion even if its a long road

Agreed good sir.

[Videra]

TLDR: a tank took massive umbrage to a WHM DPSing a trash pull whilst streaming on Twitch to the point of various language proceeding to sitting there mid pull trying to vote kick them for cheating on stream. Further digging quickly showed that the guy had a pretty serious case of bad attitude towards healing in general. The popcorn only came in salted flavour that night.

Probably the biggest take away from all if it is how he made no attempt to ask the WHM what they were doing to either ask them to to tone it down more to his liking or even get a feel for if they had a handle on it as things where (which looked to be the situation in the clips). I don't particularly blame him for ignoring the sea of trolls that came after him, but it seemed clear that he was happy to remain completely ignorant of any enlightenment about the situation.

A terrible tank took umbrage with a good healer. Woe is he. Let's not give that piece of shit any more recognition, hmm?

[Knoahl]

Now that I've seen more of the posts. I think I have a better grasp of the situation. It's bad players misinterpreting the fact that good players being efficient with their gcds as "OMG I must dps as much as possible". What I was giving Sebazy a "goldfish" moment with was that the lack of context made it seem more like they where being arrogant. It sounds less so with the context and I'll apologize for that.

As for me, I'm still gonna be optimistic. I like playing the healers boring rotation and all and I've no issues defending that. Are there things they could improve on? Sure. But until then I guess I'm gonna chill in my fishbowl and be positive about what I got and what I'm getting.

Lmao sounds good, I'm sorry for being passive also, being optimistic is the best, I'm just bitter from all these expansions we have held out hope. The healers are far from unplayable, we just need to keep giving feedback where we can I guess.