The 'unwritten rule' for non-tank pulls in dungeons

[ElroyDrundan]

Because god forbid I want to run a dungeon I've never run before as a tank a little carefully?

I have never been in a group where a tank who says, "first time in here any tips" was treated poorly. Quite the opposite in fact. We will go with the single pulls if needed, give advice, call out anything major to avoid etc...It is in all of our best interests to get more quality tanks at max level. We often after a few pulls coax the tank to pull two groups, hold off until the tank is situated and then let lose with dps. Nothing helps a tank pull big than seeing how fast and fun it can be.

[Krotoan]

You do you. Not everyone here is as kick happy or self centered as some people are around here.

The part i'm a little aghast at is that poster condones that particular reaction as not only OK but appropriate. I get other people will run as they will and i even accept that if I don't run a dungeon fast enough i might get kicked. I don't ever think "LRN 2..." responses are ever ok though especially when responding to polite or at least civil requests.

[van_arn]

You do you. Not everyone here is as kick happy or self centered as some people are around here.

Exactly. As long as your party is fine with it, go ahead.

If they're not, though, you have no choice but to follow the party's wishes or get kicked.

[Ceridwenae]

the reason you keep citing Brayflox as some kind of gold standard to knowing how to tank is baffling to me.... you CAN pull larger groups in there, but nothing about the dungeon says you have to. There's nothing about that dungeon that serves as a training ground that forces the tank to grab larger groups, if anything it's a training ground for the tank to be aware of patrolling enemies.



You're both right and wrong here. Playing DPS alongside tanking, I never saw a wall to wall pull until I started running level 60 dungeons...

I think Brayflox because you have a tank stance in there and can shine in mass pulls, so it's the first legitimate place a new tank can practice... but you're also right in that there's nothing at the start that says that, and it relies upon the (new) individual to be aware of the possibilities. I suppose if there's a confident sprout someone who's tanked before there and has the knowledge, or there's a Vet Wot Knows Stuff, they can let the new tank know they can have some more fun..? The mid section is great for figuring patrols, but it's possible to keep reeling stuff in if the team's happy for it. I've had a tank collect the lot up in a nice bunch and have me bard LB it. It certainly wasn't what I'd been used to in there, but it was really effective. That tank was not new in the slightest, however. Van_Arn can probably elaborate if they so wish.

As for mass pulls, someone brought up Castrum Meridianum for that. When I first started running it regularly (as part of the Roulette That Shall Not Be Named), it seemed to be standard practice. Doing bard for it, or Summoner, I quite enjoyed lots of stuff going on. EDIT: Forgot to say, when doing this roulette again of late for moogle tomes, there's been some really choppy, slower pulls and... eh. It felt off after being used to mass pullage there. I honestly don't care either way because I'm in a place where I want to adapt to what the party wants, but it is glorious when the tank(s) are confident enough to just drag the whole lot at the start down to the first boss area. I'm a bard and I like to DoT'n'Run! Don't recall how it was 50-60, but it seems the norm post-60.
I don't actually have a pony in the race, though, and as DPS will mostly let the tank and healer figure it out. I don't require speed runs at all, but at this point I'll just go with it if they want to do that. I'd only say something if they needed further input. I couldn't tank it myself like that, but there again, I don't bother other people with my tanking (it's the best for everyone involved).

That said, I'd love to know what the One Button tanks press is. I'm pressing more than one button when I do it, so am I doing it wrong? What is the button I'm supposed to press on WAR, say? I'm not being sarcastic, I really want to know!

[wereotter]

I think Brayflox because you have a tank stance in there and can shine in mass pulls, so it's the first legitimate place a new tank can practice... but you're also right in that there's nothing at the start that says that, and it relies upon the (new) individual to be aware of the possibilities. I suppose if there's a confident sprout someone who's tanked before there and has the knowledge, or there's a Vet Wot Knows Stuff, they can let the new tank know they can have some more fun..? The mid section is great for figuring patrols, but it's possible to keep reeling stuff in if the team's happy for it. I've had a tank collect the lot up in a nice bunch and have me bard LB it. It certainly wasn't what I'd been used to in there, but it was really effective. That tank was not new in the slightest, however. Van_Arn can probably elaborate if they so wish.

As for mass pulls, someone brought up Castrum Meridianum for that. When I first started running it regularly (as part of the Roulette That Shall Not Be Named), it seemed to be standard practice. Doing bard for it, or Summoner, I quite enjoyed lots of stuff going on. Don't recall how it was 50-60, but it seems the norm post-60. I don't actually have a pony in the race, though, and as DPS will just let the tank and healer figure it out. I don't require speed runs at all, but at this point I'll just go with it if they want to do that. I'd only say something if they needed further input. I couldn't tank it myself like that, but there again, I don't bother other people with my tanking.

That said, I'd love to know what the One Button tanks press is. I'm pressing more than one button when I do it, so am I doing it wrong? What is the button I'm supposed to press on WAR, say? I'm not being sarcastic, I really want to know!

Now that you bring it up, I do remember it being in the main scenario roulette, but I think I kind of looked at that differently considering you had four healers and two tanks, so I didn't assume that this would be the standard for every other dungeon after that. Though it is also fair to say that I wasn't running main scenario roulette while I was trying to catch up with friends who had already completed Heavesnward, and leveling dungeons weren't really a place people did mass pulls. It might help tanks as they level if there were more level 50 main story dungeons. But as it is, a player going through the content will be unlikely to see this as the standard until they hit the end of Heavensward in standard for member parties. That's a lot of time wasted being unable to practice that skill.

It might also help if earlier dungeons simply had pulls that had 6-8 mobs. The Vault does this a little, but I'm thinking perhaps even more than that. Not for every pull, but if for maybe just one or two of them in a select few dungeons that show tanks what more they can handle. This would also be a good practice for leveling healers to see before they start with those later dungeons and end up caught off guard.

[Yeol]

People love to make things complected.

It is the tanks duty to pull and hold enmity, not yours. Focus on your primary role and let the rest of the party focus on theirs.
At the end of the day, it is just a simple duty. Don't make it harder than it should be.

Tanks can be slow for multiple reasons.
- New to the role/inexperienced.
- New to the dungeon.
- Under geared.
- Disabilities.

If these things don't matter to you, then prepare for potential wipes.
Don't blame your tank if you do wipe. It was your action that caused it. Your action, you take responsibility for it.

If you do not like being with a slow tank you have two options:
1) You kick the tank.
2) You leave the party.

But the best option would be:
3) You adapt to your slow tank.

--> Duty Complete

[Krotoan]

I have never been in a group where a tank who says, "first time in here any tips" was treated poorly. Quite the opposite in fact. We will go with the single pulls if needed, give advice, call out anything major to avoid etc...It is in all of our best interests to get more quality tanks at max level. We often after a few pulls coax the tank to pull two groups, hold off until the tank is situated and then let lose with dps. Nothing helps a tank pull big than seeing how fast and fun it can be.

The example I'm giving though, and a few I've experienced were very rude responses. I'm game for big pulls on the first run if everyone agrees to it I.E "I'll pull big if you want but I'm not totally confident with it, possible wipes". If they all say go.. hell.. I'll go.
But the "LRN 2 TANK WTF SO SLOW" guy? naw.. that really doesn't deserve any sort of acknowledgement or response.

I am willing to communicate, I am unwilling to encourage rude behavior.

[Kolsykol]

If I am tanking and you pull as a dps, I am going to call you out on it and if you continue doing it I am going to either kick you or leave.
It's extremely frustrating and shows disrespect for the tank imo.

As a tank one of your jobs is to make sure that everyone is there and ready, a lot of the time when it's a dps just running in and pulling we get killed because I've noticed that the healer is afk.
And even if that isn't the case it's still annoying, and there's no reason to do it even because I don't pull slowly to begin with.

'' If you pull it, you tank it '' is my attitude but I don't let people die if they do it the first time.
I'll probably only let them die the third time, because at that point I know that they're not listening and won't stop.

[Kaylessa]

As a healer main, please do not pull big in Brayflox normal. It is the worst 1-50 dungeon to heal in the duty finder because tanks want to try and pull big there which means the healer will sometimes go through the whole dungeon with no mp I especially love those times when the tank initiates the boss fight when the healer has 1/3 mp, and lucid's on cooldown ahaha ... *cries in white mage*

When I'm tanking I don't mind if you pull for me, it just means I'm probably going too slow for the group

[ADVSS]

snip

Im sorry but I couldnt help noticing, best char name in the game and you heal too? LOL 10/10