We Really Need To Talk About The State And Path Of FFXIV

[van_arn]

We are playing an MMORPG Like most RPGs, the story implementation is just as big to the game as the gameplay itself. Yes, both experiences are separate but that doesn't make one more important then the other. They are both equally as important for the success of the game as a whole. Plus many great developers put their heart and soul in crafting great plots and characters for us to experience, not to be thrown to the wayside. Kazutoyo Maehiro being the main scenario writer has done an amazing job in crafting various likable characters as well as amazing plot. Then there is the world & lore of the entire game done by Koji Fox. Without all that the game would be rather bland. Think CODIV now that they removed the campaign mode.

Yeah this doesn't matter. Not everyone is here to play a single player rpg, and square isn't able to make people care about the story.

Design emphasis or no.

Story only matters on patch day, anyway.

[Melichoir]

Yeah this doesn't matter. Not everyone is here to play a single player rpg, and square isn't able to make people care about the story.

Design emphasis or no.

Story only matters on patch day, anyway.

Yeah, except if thats what the devs are focusing on and you choose not to partake of it, thats on you not the devs. This would be like going to a steak restaurant and only going there for the chicken appetizer. You can do that, but complaining that the restaurant specializes on steak and not chicken appetizers is on you, not the restaurant.

People dont have to care about the MSQ, but the devs do, and the game is built with that in mind.

[JohnSpawnVFX]

Yeah this doesn't matter. Not everyone is here to play a single player rpg, and square isn't able to make people care about the story.

Design emphasis or no.

If the game doesn't appeal to you, find one that does, buy a skip potion or skip cutscenes manually. There's nothing wrong with the game not fitting your taste, but you don't get to subvert the game to cater to your whims

Story only matters on patch day, anyway.

I guess new players only start playing on patch day /s

[Physic]

We are playing an MMORPG Like most RPGs, the story implementation is just as big to the game as the gameplay itself. Yes, both experiences are separate but that doesn't make one more important then the other. They are both equally as important for the success of the game as a whole. Plus many great developers put their heart and soul in crafting great plots and characters for us to experience, not to be thrown to the wayside. Kazutoyo Maehiro being the main scenario writer has done an amazing job in crafting various likable characters as well as amazing plot. Then there is the world & lore of the entire game done by Koji Fox. Without all that the game would be rather bland. Think CODIV now that they removed the campaign mode.

RPG, to many just means creating a charachter, choosing their path, and taking them through the world. Its not always about watching/listening to a long narrative you dont interact with. No one is saying remove msq, people are saying forcing people to watch/listen to 100s of hours of a story isnt going to work for everyone. Also, world and lore isnt the same as msq.

I honestly think youd get more people paying attention to more of the msq, if they werent doing it just to unlock something else. Its like if you told a kid he had to turn 500 pages of basketball book before he could touch a basketball, do you think every kid is going to read it?

[van_arn]

If the game doesn't appeal to you, find one that does, buy a skip potion or skip cutscenes manually. There's nothing wrong with the game not fitting your taste, but you don't get to subvert the game to cater to your whims


I guess new players only start playing on patch day /s

I've been around longer than these forums have. I'll play what I want, subvert what I please, and poke sacred cows whenever I please.


And yes, the whole problem of the msq is a new player is trapped in patch day for months. If you don't know what that means, then you are fundamentally incapable of understanding these complaints.

Not everyone plays for hammy cutscenes and that's okay. Some people like to watch cutscenes in the inn and that's OK.

[PyurBlue]

Yeah, except if thats what the devs are focusing on and you choose not to partake of it, thats on you not the devs. This would be like going to a steak restaurant and only going there for the chicken appetizer. You can do that, but complaining that the restaurant specializes on steak and not chicken appetizers is on you, not the restaurant.

People dont have to care about the MSQ, but the devs do, and the game is built with that in mind.

I don't think the analogy directly corresponds with FF14. If anything I'd liken the MSQ more to the appetizer just based on how I play. Being more fair though, it's probably more accurate to call the MSQ one of multiple options for the main course. Saying that it should be done away with is silly, but it's equally silly to insist that the entire FF14 experience revolves around it. You can play FF14 without giving the story any attention, all while being a fan of the game and thoroughly enjoying.

Not directing this at you, but the posts that say "go find another game" miss the point. People don't want to find another game because FF14, minus the story, appeals to them. The MSQ is optional. That's OK and that doesn't mean that people want to take it away.

[FoxyAreku]

"Sense of discovery and exploration" just doesn't work in MMOs really, and attempts to capture that by making things difficult to reach just turns into tedium.

[JohnSpawnVFX]

I've been around longer than these forums have. I'll play what I want, subvert what I please, and poke sacred cows whenever I please.

Hey, if you want to joust with windmills, feel free. Doesn't mean anyone including the devs should give you the time of day.

And yes, the whole problem of the msq is a new player is trapped in patch day for months. If you don't know what that means, then you are fundamentally incapable of understanding these complaints.

No, I'm just an endgame player who isn't so jaded and laser-focused with endgame that I feel everything else should be warped and channeled torwards it.

Not everyone plays for hammy cutscenes and that's okay. Some people like to watch cutscenes in the inn and that's OK.

FFXIV is know for its "hammy cutscenes". Are we really going to a meat restaurant asking for fish, and stomping our feet till the owner changes the whole menu to fish?
You and anyone else want the endgame day zero? There's the jump potions for that. No need to change the game to cater to someone's whims. For such a knowledgeable veteran, you skipped school the day they taught "An mmo that changes its fundamental premise risks alienating most of its playerbase".

[Melichoir]

its weird to me that you think the only difference between WoW and ffxiv is the content lock of MSQ.
You feel like msq is what the game is primarily about, and that its important for each player to go through it the same way, i disagree. Msq is a book, or a movie, not a game. A game requires that all players follow similar rules, such that its fair, but a book/movie is different. Some people love the movie part of ffxiv, some dont.

Put yourself in someone elses shoes here. Imagine you don't need/like/care about story. Now imagine someone is making you watch 110 hours of something or fast foward through it for 50 hours in order to access the actual game portion. or you can pay 25 dollars.

If the story was actually integral to how the game is played, and an integrated part of the experience, like a pen and paper rpg, i would agree with you, but its simply not. Its a seperate thing which has no effect on your play if other people do it.

This is where youre not thinking about the implications of MSQ does, both at a game level and meta level and why it separates htis game from WoW. The MSQ, unlike wow, gives something everyone can focus around and be a part of. In WoW, story is irrelevant, and the game encourages you to rush to current content and then to max level so you can get raid gear and big shiny equipment to show off. It creatse a lack of player investment in the world at large, and what investment it does create gets turned toxic rapidly through elitism and division among the player base on what should be focused on. The MSQ, on the other hand, has less of that. Anyone can be a part of the MSQ, it creates investment in teh world at large for most players I would hazard, and allows people to talk part of the game without talking about being BiS. A common conversation, so to speak, that people are equally invested in.

Furthermore, you say that the game is making you sit through the MSQ to get to the actual game? What do you think we're doing? What do you think the MSQ is? That is part of the game. Youre not being stopped from playing the game. Youre still playing it, just an older portion of it. But its all still content. It doesnt stop being content just because an xpac comes out. It's a matter of perspective here where we dont see eye to eye. From what Im understanding, you really dont see anything before current xpac (or patch) as being worth doing. It's old. But to most new players, experiencing a new world with new lore and new characters and new quests and new classes, this is all new to them. This is all new content. I would hazard that players who want to skip to the end, dont care about MSQ, and the like, are players who have come from MMOs that are like wow. Where the story is inconsequential, and they were encouraged to power to max because 'thats where the game is at', not realizing that in FFXIV's case, the story does matter, and is a big part of the intended experience.

I don't think the analogy directly corresponds with FF14. If anything I'd liken the MSQ more to the appetizer just based on how I play. Being more fair though, it's probably more accurate to call the MSQ one of multiple options for the main course. Saying that it should be done away with is silly, but it's equally silly to insist that the entire FF14 experience revolves around it. You can play FF14 without giving the story any attention, all while being a fan of the game and thoroughly enjoying.

Not directing this at you, but the posts that say "go find another game" miss the point. People don't want to find another game because FF14, minus the story, appeals to them. The MSQ is optional. That's OK and that doesn't mean that people want to take it away.

As I explain above, I personally feel the MSQ results in a different play experience. Unlike wow, where they dont care if you pass the lore, FFXIV doesnt do this. The trouble is what happens if you make hte MSQ optional. It will then default to being just like wow. You can skip content, and will be actively encouraged to do so (more so by the player base now), and shift focus towards the only thing being worthwhile being the end game. Atleast with MSQ being waht it is, everyone plays it, experiences it, and understands it. The world has more meaning, and the MSQ gets you invested in something other than end game.

Im not saying the MSQ is perfect, or that it doesnt need some level of pruning. I fully understand that 3 or 4 xpacs from now, expecting players to have to play from the start of 2.0 to current is going to be a bit much. Streamlining will be necessary. But there is a difference in streamlining and flat out making the MSQ a glorified side quest that most start players will skip based on end expectations from other MMOs and some of the veterans here.

[linay]

people are saying forcing people to watch/listen to 100s of hours of a story isnt going to work for everyone.

In my humble opinion, so be it. There are alternative MMORPGs out there, and they all won't work for everyone either. Everyone can choose what works for them and story quests being central to this one game works for me.