What consumers expect of a FF-title

[Betelgeuzah]

I expect something I haven't seen in a FF in a long time: Deep storyline with interesting characters and character development. Last FF that ever grabbed my attention like that was 9.

How can they bring back something that never even existed? Good luck Square.

[Bowen]

How can they bring back something that never even existed? Good luck Square.

You know sometimes I totally agree with your posts thinking they are %100 the truth. And then there are times like this when I feel like your being a troll. . .
Make up your mind :S

[Charismatic]

He's always trolling.
When you agree with him it is a sign that you are insane.

[Betelgeuzah]

You know sometimes I totally agree with your posts thinking they are %100 the truth. And then there are times like this when I feel like your being a troll. . .
Make up your mind :S

Would it be completely and utterly insane to assume, that a pre/teen of today would like the story and characters of, say, XIII a great deal more than the people in their 20's/30's with significantly more accumulated experience in relation to all kinds of stories in general, the patterns they generally consist of and the capability to understand extremely complex and abstract ideas with relative ease?

Would it be insane to assume, that stories "made for adults" (especially those that could be considered "good") differ in content in more ways than just having more cursing, alcohol and violence?

Now, generally speaking, how old were all of you when you played these games with "good stories"? I'm sure it has absolutely no relation to how each and all of you perceived them, even though you had a significantly less developed taste and experience. That was sarcasm.

So, whatever really. Claiming me to be a troll surely is the easiest way out though. That way there is no need to self-reflect while making all of my points unvalid regardless of their accuracy, so it is understandable.

[viion]

I expect something I haven't seen in a FF in a long time: Deep storyline with interesting characters and character development. Last FF that ever grabbed my attention like that was 9.

Oh man i completely agree, 9 characters were great, then i play ff13 and its like im viewing the same characteristics and persona across all characters. All wanting to be a hero all wanting to be insanely meaningful and all of them being insanely emotional. No flavour imo.

[Malakhim]

How can they bring back something that never even existed? Good luck Square.

I have to agree with this. Anyone who thinks the stories of video games have even come close to many works of literature or film hasn't branched out nearly enough. The stories themselves are competent, with FFVI hitting some mature themes and dark areas, FFXIII's flawed and distressed characters, and FFXII aiming for political intrigue, duty, etc., but all these stories aren't that far removed from young adult anime or manga.

That doesn't detract from them by far, and I still enjoy their stories, but they are what they are and there can be no denying that.

[Jennestia]

I have to agree with this. Anyone who thinks the stories of video games have even come close to many works of literature or film hasn't branched out nearly enough

And yet: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metal_G...ion_and_legacy

It's not about people "not branching out enough" it's about what you personally define as a good story or not, but it can't be denied that video game companies have done very good story telling (Square included.)

That doesn't detract from them by far, and I still enjoy their stories, but they are what they are and there can be no denying that.

This is true about everything in life.

[Betelgeuzah]

That doesn't detract from them by far, and I still enjoy their stories, but they are what they are and there can be no denying that.

The whole franchise is based on a denial. People played these simple stories while they were young enough to appreciate them and that experience is being directly applied to anything that has come afterwards.

How is it possible for some people to keep FFX in high regard while other people think of it as the beginning of the end? It is because the whole subjectivity is what makes this franchise for each and all of us and it is directly related to our stage of life and accummulated experience at the point these games were experienced.

In fact not much has happened in the last decades. And to a great deal of people fond of the franchise, that precisely is the problem. It happened with FFVII to people who had played FFIV to VI, it happened with X to people who had played VII to IX and it happened with XIII to people who had played X. However now we have external factors to blame that people can use as a scapegoat like the departure of Sakaguchi and Squaresoft becoming SE, also Wada. They make for a great excuse for people to apply a creative fallacy to something they don't quite understand themselves. We are always looking for a reason for anything, and this franchise is the best example of a victim of that sort of thing.

It's not about people "not branching out enough" it's about what you personally define as a good story or not,

In that case there should be no arguments about stories in general. Every story should be considered equal. That's not the case, though, as stories can be perceived objectically as well as subjectively which justifies comparing and analyzing them.

Kojima's productions can, also, be analyzed and when all is said and done it is not surprising that the end result does not hold up to the perceived grandness of his supposedly good storytelling. On the other hand MGS2 for example excels if not in storytelling, in an attempt to make a point about the dangers of media and its usage in general. This goes way beyond just the game itself though and starts from the early footage from pre-launch (with Kojima fooling everyone about Snake's role in the game) and continuing up until the dialogue with Raiden and Snake that sums up Kojima's whole point with the game.

"Why didn't you tell me the whole shadow moses project was all a lie??"
"You never asked."

Just like people believed that Snake was going to be the protagonist just because Kojima showed them some edited footage with Snake in it.

Brilliant. But anyway, MGS4 is a retcon after retcon. Still better than what the FF franchise has ever come up with though.

[Keisuna]

The whole franchise is based on a denial. People played these simple stories while they were young enough to appreciate them and that experience is being directly applied to anything that has come afterwards.

I don't think so. I was well into adulthood when I finally got my hands on Final Fantasy III and I enjoyed it just as much as I enjoyed the previous games. Personal preference and nostalgia may be a factor, but it's not the whole story by a long shot. The feel of a game is very much a product of the people who designed it. Suggesting that these people can be interchanged without altering the entire feel of the game doesn't make sense at all.

[Betelgeuzah]

I don't think so. I was well into adulthood when I finally got my hands on Final Fantasy III and I enjoyed it just as much as I enjoyed the previous games. Personal preference and nostalgia may be a factor, but it's not the whole story by a long shot. The feel of a game is very much a product of the people who designed it. Suggesting that these people can be interchanged without altering the entire feel of the game doesn't make sense at all.

The fact that it's a different form of media than you're used to is surely to be a factor that can not be denied. Especially considering the (possible) expectations you have set beforehand for stories in said format, in the age of Super Marios and Sonic the Hedgehogs forming the standard with barebones stories in them.

We can also think about the experience of improved visuals factoring into the total package. PSX after SNES was a huge leap in visual quality (a core part of gaming in general) and the same can be said about PS2. Then, it should also be noted that the games in question were released early in their respective consoles lifespans (starting from VII) which further accounted for the perception of the overall experience.

None of these factors have anything to do with the story but nonetheless account into why exactly people feel the way they do about these games.