Male Viera as a playable character! show your support

[Lauront]

Is there something wrong with an ideologically or conceptually motivated request? Because it really is that simple. It's just a quirky change that goes against the status quo of men always being taller than women at max height, nothing more.

Wrong? No, not in the abstract. But it's not a question of validity in the abstract - it's a question about how the trait is value-additive. Like, if you were to compare Hrothgar and most current races, they are very different due to the bestial faces, and like I said it's an open question as to whether it will be a "good" difference. Do you think Viera males being shorter than the females is in any way going to make the race more attractive to people considering playing it? A handful, perhaps, but it does not fundamentally affect their aesthetics.

The reason I don't play female Au Ra, for example, as an alt (I am partial to male main toons), is not because of the fact that they're shorter than the males. It's because they're shrimpy. I'd be happy if I could just get one to highlander female height. Hell, even midlander.

Now you just sound like a lot of anti genderlock-removal people XD

I don't think so. I am just drawing into question what the a priori virtue of being "different" is, i.e. how is the difference value-additive?

The exact same thing can be said about the males being taller. Which leaves us with the opposite - where the females are taller - being different to all other races, which gives that option an edge.

I mean I gave the reason as to why people like that. It's to do with what is deemed most attractive for each gender - and this is not just due to "society" but because of traits associated with sexual reproductive fitness that feature prominently in what we now consider attractive. Of course there's outliers who don't share the usual views on what is attractive but it is besides the point as to why a developer would usually focus on the males being taller. Again: it is a difference, but not all differences are value-additive. The typical male/female height discrepancy is down to what humans consider attractive and therefore figures in positively to such calculations. I'm not fundamentally opposed to it altering for certain fantasy races, to be clear, but in and of itself I don't find it to be a hugely compelling difference.

I will concede that the males' range being beyond the females' in both directions is in and of itself a unique, new option that I don't think exists in the game.

I'm not really proposing it for that reason; I am proposing it because it accommodates those who want the smaller option. Nonetheless, you could take it that way, I guess.

Really, the primary differences of Viera should feature in areas beyond their height range. I think drawing on the feline poses for miqo'te really added to their look in a positive way. It makes them look the part. It's just difficult to emulate rabbits in the same way, because whereas cats are physically elegant and menacing in their posture, rabbits have a goofiness to them. I guess they could figure out a way to handle it, perhaps in their jump animations. The ears are already more detailed than anything we've seen on any other race.

[Senn]

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Yeah I mean, we're sorely lacking in tall, muscular, and handsome males for sure...

Needs more tall and buff men.

[BillyKaplan]

It's just difficult to emulate rabbits

Funny you should say that, because adhering to the height difference would be a very simple way to emulate rabbits <:

Yeah I mean, we're sorely lacking in tall, muscular, and handsome males for sure...

To be fair, I'd totes drink that "mViera based on mAu Ra" kool aid if they gave it to us :x and a very similar argument can be used against using Elezen as base or aiming even towards Omega-M because male Elezen exist. In that sense I feel like the devs should make a decision and whatever base they use, Viera-fy like they did for the fem Elezen model for the female Viera. But I don't feel like either argument really has a strong case either way.
If anything, male Au Ra being used isn't as unlikely - main reason why fem Elezen were used for fem Viera is because they didn't have fem Au Ra available as an alternative... it was either Elezen or Roe. Males, on the other hand, have a choice between Au Ra and Elezen. Now it depends on what the devs will go with, but either "already exists in the game" in that sense.

[Theodric]

Can you clarify what you mean by "classically handsome?"

Sure. Something along these lines:



Someone who isn't hyper masculine though clearly male and more likely to conjure up imagery of a charming knight in shining armour.

I'm not suggesting that Highlander men aren't handsome. They can be designed to quite attractive, though they look somewhat old and are always rugged in their features.

[Fukuro]

I love A! But he is waaay to tall. I don't want a gender dysmorph like the au ra's have it. Make the male just as big as the female... So you'll see females ingame being bigger than the males and vice versa!

B is also really nice, but i would prefer them as a subrace and smaller than the females.
A for me looks like a elegant, slim, beautifull viera, which i personally really like design wise! But i'd gladly accept both of them ingame, if SE decides to add them.

[Senn]

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I mean, I would respect what the developers give us.
However, take a look at elezen. Their proportions are so off. Heads too small, neck too long, no good face options, horrid animations, and etc... Why do you guys think elezen are hardly played?
Male viera could be what elezens failed to do. Yoshi P described male viera just how I would like them. I hope the dev team just does their own thing when designing male viera.

[Senn]

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Uuh so that's pretty much a midlander right there.

[Theodric]

I hope the dev team just does their own thing when designing male viera.

Perhaps it would be of immense benefit to adjust the original post to reinforce that view? That way, everybody is accounted for and nobody is priortised over others unintentionally or otherwise.

Uuh so that's pretty much a midlander right there.

The facial structure is a reflection of features commonly seen as 'classically handsome'. It can easily be attributed to numerous playable races. I don't have much else at hand, nothing appropriate to post here at any rate...

[Senn]

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I already told people I'm not going to touch my original post again. I'm sure they have staff reading through the entire thread.

[Lauront]

Funny you should say that, because adhering to the height difference would be a very simple way to emulate rabbits <:

In the laziest possible way. At least the things you mentioned with miqo'te have a visible impact on their design. I honestly think it's why they have put so much focus on the females' ears, and the slightly scrunched up nasal area - I do think that is a trait they could actually embellish on for the males, perhaps on an optional basis.

That said, we haven't seen the full range of movement for the females, so maybe there's more to it.

Yeah I mean, we're sorely lacking in tall, muscular, and handsome males for sure...

Needs more tall and buff men.

Yes, and his problem with au ra is that the facial scales prohibits the use of facial hair on them. Plus the horns and tails. These things don't bother me, because I like the handsome demon trope, but they do other people, and they're explicit components in their design allowing them to straddle both the humanoid and "bestial" camps, since they go furthest in that respect than anything else besides Hrothgar. The way the hips look in some outfits is also a turn off to many, and it baffles me why SE designed them like that there. All that aside, facially they would be the closest to "classically handsome".