Dear SE, I am a Healer

[rachcouture]

If dps aren't differentiated, why is it that people who are recruiting for their raid team or pug ask for specific dps classes to join? Why recruit a specific class if any old dps is fine?

Or...could it be...that there are differences between being a melee and ranged? Differences between being a caster and ranged phys dps? That some classes have certain buffs while others do not? That certain types of classes are better suited to certain types of fights?

Dps have sub-types, as mentioned by cicatriz31, the SE devs clearly look upon it this way. They don't lump all dps together. They consider melee, caster and ranged phys to be distinct.

Also healers have sub-types as well. They mainly fall into two types; raw healing and mitigation (shields). But the difference is all healers bring the exact same role actions to a fight. This is not the case with dps.

Currently there are only two ranged phys dps in the game. Among the selection of role actions, theirs has the smallest number of classes that have it. Every other group of role actions has at least three classes. This needed to change. So we got dancer.

I'm not happy we are not getting a new healer but I'm not going to pretend that the addition of a ranged phys dps makes no sense. It makes a lot of sense.

They recruit specific DPSes because of what skills they bring to the table, not because of where they fall under the melee/range/caster separations. For instance: NIN is a common pick for its support even though it's melee, not a ranged DPS. MCH, comparatively, has rarely been considered for anything.

There didn't need to be two DPSes in Stormblood, and there definitely doesn't need to be a new one now. All this does is further the role disparity.

keyword here "used to".

We're talking about what the game is 'designed around'. I think how it existed at launch is incredibly relevant in that case.

[cicatriz313]

They recruit specific DPSes because of what skills they bring to the table, not because of where they fall under the melee/range/caster separations. For instance: NIN is a common pick for its support even though it's melee, not a ranged DPS. MCH, comparatively, has rarely been considered for anything.

There didn't need to be two DPSes in Stormblood, and there definitely doesn't need to be a new one now. All this does is further the role disparity.



We're talking about what the game is 'designed around'. I think how it existed at launch is incredibly relevant in that case.

First off, that's because bard is the better job in that subtype, and EVERY group wants a bard for refresh/tactician which oh, wait, you mean only ranged physical bring those? Amazing. It's almost like that's part of game design. Also most people want a ninja for trick attack because it's a good skill sure, but they also don't want 4 melee because fights are designed around having less melee usually. Second, no how the game was launched has little bearing on anything because the game has been out for over 5 years and it's changed since then with the types of jobs and the abilities of jobs. (Remember cross class skills? And how bard used to have a healing LB3?)

[Fland]

and EVERY group wants a bard for refresh/tactician

Not every group.

Also the groups that do want BRD want it because BRD own toolkits that is not shared like refresh. Otherwise they'd be find with MCH.

people pick a tank because they want to tank, and healer because they want to heal, but everything else? not really.

Not really. Some maybe.
I know a couple people who play DRK because they want to play a job with big sword, not because they specifically want to tank.
And I personally play SCH not specifically because it's a healer.

Oh and also a lot of my friends choose a DPS because they specifically want to DPS.

[cicatriz313]

Not every group.

Also the groups that do want BRD want it because BRD own toolkits that is not shared like refresh. Otherwise they'd be find with MCH.



Not really. Some maybe.
I know a couple people who play DRK because they want to play a job with big sword, not because they specifically want to tank.
And I personally play SCH not specifically because it's a healer.

Oh and also a lot of my friends choose a DPS because they specifically want to DPS.

Lol, you don't even make points anymore guy. Like I already said BRD is the better job in that same post, you just didn't quote it. A lot of my friends choose SPECIFIC dps because they want to play in SPECIFIC types of ways while DPSing. These types each will have 3-4 choices in 5.0. Because Yoshi said so.

And for the 5.x, I wish for a compensation for those last 4 years of unbalanced things, and for having to wait 6 years for a new job, maybe we also deserve a mount for every healing job? Like the tanks does?

Tanks get mounts because they're the least played. If healers become the least played, maybe you will get mounts. Until then? Nah.

When a healer changes to a tank or a DPS role they are no longer a healer. They are now out of their preferred role.

I don't know how many times I have to reiterate this. Just because all dps share a ROLE it doesn't mean they all want to play the other jobs in that ROLE. I don't have any more luxury of choice than you do as a healer if I want to play a caster. I have BLM, RDM, and SMN. It doesn't matter if they're not separated by the trinity or anything, they play differently and people prefer what they prefer. The fact that everyone that says otherwise IS A HEALER is telling. It's not about dps choices, it's just you wanting more jobs and using bad arguments to try to justify it because they already explained a logical reason for why you're not getting one.

Just because you personally don't like a job, doesn't mean that job didn't exist as a choice within that role.

It's like being brought to a buffet and saying "There is no food!", because all the stuff there were things you didn't personally like. The food exists, you just choose not to eat it.

Guess what? There's new food to the game buffet called dancer and gunbreaker. If it's not your cup of tea, tough. You have just as much access to it as I would to a dps I don't want to try out.

more edits: I'm not ignoring facts here. It's not a narrative. I simply don't think roles matter as much as playstyle in job choices. Like I'm sorry, but I've already made my points on this clear. If you think I don't make sense, I can't help you because you're just hoping for an echo chamber. So yeah, I don't care what you think anymore because your post is predicated on a false premise, that the devs do not subscribe to, and therefore you don't deserve anything. IF you get one in the 5.x series, which isn't likely, you should be grateful.

[Miste]

Lol, you don't even make points anymore guy.

You aren't really making any points either, the things you are saying make little sense, but most people have given up bothering to reply.

I'm not getting heated, I'm using caps for emphasis because people like you keep saying that if I want variety I can just go play another dps and since it's the same role I should be happy with it. Which is inaccurate.

This for example.

Just because you personally don't like a job, doesn't mean that job didn't exist as a choice within that role.

It's like being brought to a buffet and saying "There is no food!", because all the stuff there were things you didn't personally like. The food exists, you just choose not to eat it.

Guess what? There's new food to the game buffet called dancer and gunbreaker. If it's not your cup of tea, tough. You have just as much access to it as I would to a dps I don't want to try out.

I said "within that role"

So, nice try....you really do ignore any fact that doesn't suit your narrative, sheesh.

[Physic]

You aren't really making any points either, the things you are saying make little sense, but most people have given up bothering to reply.



This for example.

Just because you personally don't like a job, doesn't mean that job didn't exist as a choice within that role.

It's like being brought to a buffet and saying "There is no food!", because all the stuff there were things you didn't personally like. The food exists, you just choose not to eat it.




I said "within that role"

So, nice try....you really do ignore any fact that doesn't suit your narrative, sheesh.

in your buffet example, its like you had carbohydrates, vegetables and meats.

and then you are telling people who eat fish they should be happy whenever they add pork to the menu.

no, just because i want fried fish does not mean i want barbeque pork.

just because i want cake does not mean i am happy when they add rice to the menu.

i get it, a vegitarian may feel like all meats serve the same desire/purpose, that doesnt mean thats how the other customers see it. And if you own a restaraunt, you probably need more categories that dont fall neatly into 3 groups, because thats not how many customers choose what to eat.

[Fland]

Lol, you don't even make points anymore guy. Like I already said BRD is the better job in that same post, you just didn't quote it. A lot of my friends choose SPECIFIC dps because they want to play in SPECIFIC types of ways while DPSing. These types each will have 3-4 choices in 5.0. Because Yoshi said so.

Please don't be deliberately obtuse.
I made my point, you just ignore it.
People don't pick BRD for their group because of it's "sub-type". They don't pick BRD because the group specifically need to fill a "role" of physical range dps.
They pick BRD because it has amazing toolkits that has nothing to do with it being a physical ranged.
Also refresh/tactician has little to do on making BRD part of the meta.

[Physic]

Please don't be deliberately obtuse.
I made my point, you just ignore it.
People don't pick BRD for their group because of it's "sub-type". They don't pick BRD because the group specifically need to fill a "role" of physical range dps.
They pick BRD because it has amazing toolkits that has nothing to do with it being a physical ranged.
Also refresh/tactician has little to do on making BRD part of the meta.

they pick bard because it has very strong support that other classes benefit from, not because of its awesome dps. Which highlights that all dps dont actually serve the same purpose.

[Fland]

they pick bard because it has very strong support that other classes benefit from, not because of its awesome dps. Which highlights that all dps dont actually serve the same purpose.

If by support you mean refresh/tactician, then no, from my experiences most group that pick BRD does it not because of refresh/tactician.
If you mean BRD other toolkits which are its own, then it has nothing to do with physical range dps "role".
If having different toolkits means they fulfill different "role" in the party then each one of the jobs, including each of the healers and tanks, will have different "role".
Each melee then will have different "role" instead of just melee, then there is no use again on comparing 4 tanks, 3 healers, 10 DPS or 4 melees, 3 casters etc.

[Paladinleeds]

So yeah, I don't care what you think anymore because your post is predicated on a false premise, that the devs do not subscribe to, and therefore you don't deserve anything. IF you get one in the 5.x series, which isn't likely, you should be grateful.

So what if SE decided to delete WHM, and make a promise to never release another healer ever again, as well as make sure all healer skills were useless. So only tanks and DPS got new goodies ever again. Would that make you happy? After all, we should be grateful we still have SCH and AST right? I've been watching this thread but with how these arguments have gone, time to see what you'd REALLY be happy with. I actually think at this point they should just delete WHM (my main), and make it so only tanks and DPS only get new goodies, as well as permanently banning any player with any healer at 70 (those who level it to 70 after it won't get banned). Seems like it's the only way we're going to quell this argument.