Petition to ban Moogle exploiters.

[Tadacho]

Well if that's the case, I take it back, but even so, why would you immediately reject it. I can think of dozens of fights across several MMOs in which a viable strategy was...

- Boss with adds: pull off adds one by one. Pull adds far enough away from original spawn point so that, once adds are killed you can die, reraise, refuel and just go after the boss. Recent example I can think of was a low-man Dodore fight!

- FFXI had several boss fights were a strategy often used was to wipe at a certain point and then have everyone reraise and recover! I've never fought, but I'm pretty sure this is even a strategy used against Pandemonium Warden in FFXI. I used to do this myself when I would solo Brothers ENM - kill first minotaur, allow second to kill me so I can reraise and recover MP to then kill it. There are other examples that spring to mind from FFXI - Ark Angels, Alexander fight, and a fight on an airhsip (I don't remember details of boss).

- Common strategy even used on regular open-world mobs, particularly when soloing something that's proving difficult. Wittling it down as much as you can before running away until the mob loses aggro (or in this game "returns to territory"), quickly curing yourself up, and then going back after said mob whilst it's HP is still low and finishing it off. Whilst it's not exactly dying/raising, it is essentially the same thing (losing hate).

- What about a party that wipes in a dungeon? Should they consider it a loss, or should they raise up and recover and continue, making sure not to get any aggro from nearby mobs during the raising phase? This is a common strategy in dungeons in WoW.

You say it's a disregard for game mechanics, but I disgaree. People have recognised, "hey, moogles aggro to movement, so we can probably recover if we don't move."

Sure, maybe it was discovered as a fluke at first, but who cares? This is a strategy that has been used in MMOs for years and years in several different types of scenario, although the concept is the same - "we can recover, so long as we don't aggro."

Anyway, the whole debate is pretty moot... Regardless of this strategy, most people who want will have moogle weapons in a couple of months anyway. At least in this scenario people would have obtained those weapons by using two different strategies, rather than everyone just copying each other with Ifrit.

[Tadacho]

Now man up and get better so you can do it the proper way. Case closed.

Doesn't really bother me, I've attempted moogle for first time last night and my parties used both methods and we lost all fights haha, but I know we'll beat in time, and I'll probably end up beating it using both methods at some point ^^ I'm just really against the idea of people suddenly turning around calling this an exploit when wiping is a method that has been used as a strategy for a long time in a lot of different ways.

[DevilsAdvocate]

I never played WoW. I only played FFXI and I for the life of me can't think of a fight where I had to die and reraise to win. We never did that in any of the fights you listed. If people died it was strictly because something went wrong. And FFXI even had a re-raise spell. Sorry man. This isn't supposed to WoW2.0 This is supposed to be Final Fantasy.

[Tadacho]

I'm not saying it is, nor do I want it to be. I've played WoW for about 3 months top in my lifetime lol. FFXI did have reraise yes, which if anything, enables this strategy even more and further validates it. I'm not saying this isn't an exploit, or it is, I'm saying I don't think it is based on my experiences with MMO's and how this strategy has popped up in my shapes, ways and forms over time (losing hate, recovering, continue with fight).

It all comes down to if the moogles not aggroing to sight is intentional or not. If not, then it's a bug which is being exploited. If however the moogles aggro behaviour is as intended there is no exploit here.

[Agate]

Dey gots dey eyes closed man, dey blindness gots to be intentional.

[Haseios]

Good Lord the OP was good for a laugh. Seriously though, its not that bad (hard) to get a legit kill on it w/o using the "exploit." Just need to have people stay focused and move/react quickly. Hell I even went MRD (not tanking) for the wins I have.

Simply banning someone for taking advantage of an "exploit" is just stupid, though there's no fun in winning when using it.

[solracht]

What I do care about is the wipe/raise exploit, and the blatant disregard for basic game mechanics/rules that the people using it exhibit :/

I imagine you guys also get your Moogle key items as a group, without disbanding, splitting, or having 2-3 people do it for the rest of the party. You know, the proper and intended way.

I'm asking because if you have chosen to only follow rules that you have arbitrarily deemed as important (while you're ignoring a lot of other rules and intended ways to do things) then this complaining doesn't mean much.

[RemVye]

I'd much rather ban all the people who use crafting bots....

Oh wait... which is the greater

A.) # of people using crafting bots
OR
B.) # of people using "exploit" in Moogle fight


Result from either option A or option B = 80% or more of the community vanishes over night.
*Warning: these statistics are generated from the most accurate source of information in the World, my mind.

[Xoo]

What she said ^

We rejected that "strat" from the second we read it. As far as egos go I have yet to toot my own horn about this other than to label it as a "Legit kill". If you want me to come right out and say this then I will also add that I DO in fact think we are better than those people who have to use the death and re-raise trick. I think everyone who can beat it without doing that is in fact better than those who can't. If that makes me sound egotistical then so what? It's true fact. If it were an open world NM we'd claim it from you when you let it de-agro and murder it in front of your faces to show you don't need to pull shit like that to win a fight. Now man up and get better so you can do it the proper way. Case closed.

Using this term reminds me of figures such as John Wayne, not King Moggle Mog XII. Please, this is just a damn game. Get over it and get over yourselves.

[MyKotoShi]

OP is stupid as shit. This exploit is available anywhere in Eorzea, not just in that stupid instance.