Baldesion Arsenal Feedback

[Epidendrum]

If you don't mind me asking, where do the JP players share/find the macros used for content? I would love to see more examples than the BA one to model things on.

I'm hesitant to reply because my more recent posts seem to have been taken out of context and seen in a negative light. About Rockette's words above, yes every server is a hodgepodge of diffierent cultures. I come from Alexander, we have players from India, Singapore, Indonesia, Hong Kong, Taiwan, Philippines, Russia (Vladivostok), Canada and Mexico, we stretch across many time zones and have large variances in culture too. It's hurtful that Rockette's words seem to imply that my earlier comments didn't take culture and time zones into consideration. However despite differences in culture and time zones, we are all fluent Japanese speakers, and we have an identity as members of Alexander server, Gaia DC. Personally I'm an ethnic Chinese Singaporean, fluent in English, Chinese, Indonesian, Japanese and German. My culture is significantly different from the Japanese (whatever similarities there are, the reasons behind it are different), I just happen to be fortunate enough to have to travel around a fair bit for my work. My intention was to share techniques used in my server and DC to handle certain problematic mechanics (e.g. acceleration bomb killing many players on a platform due to poor execution), so that if nothing else, they remember that one thing and maybe it saves their arsenal run. As I said, it was taken out of context, but this is the internet - people are free to interpret my words as they wish. After years of playing FFXIV, I decided to join the English forums to share since most information that NA/EU gets about JP servers is from Tonberry/Elemental and they don't seem to know much about Gaia or Mana, but I see now that it's my mistake and I should leave.

Sorry to digress, I'll answer your question. If you're talking about raids, we (Gaia data centre's Japanese speaking community, inclusive of the non-Japanese from many countries and time zones) generally have Pekolog's blog (http://pekoe1001.blog.shinobi.jp/) with detailed explanation for mechanics. Players convert them into macros. Other places we share:
(1) lodestone, probably the fastest place to get help and find strategies. It's the best thing since sliced bread for us. A lot of knowledge transmission is done here.
(2) twitter - us non-Japanese playing on JP servers, usually keep our twitter entirely in non-English as a platform to practice foreign languages, links to a new guide on Pekolog or someone's lodestone post are retweeted. Word gets around the community fast.
(3) ffxiv mobile companion app, LS members will remind us to check someone's twitter page for a retweet or that a certain website has been updated with guides for the latest content.
(4) Dopr.net's FFXIV guides, contains detailed information and guides on virtually all content in FFXIV to date ( https://www.dopr.net/ff14playguide ).

I'll include some examples of lodestone macro sharing below:
(i) Arsenal. (https://jp.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodes.../blog/4038064/)
(ii) Omega raid. (https://jp.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodes.../blog/3924606/)
(iii) Ultima weapon: Ultimate. (https://jp.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodes.../blog/3827052/)

I hope this is what you are looking for, and will help you.

[Chiami]

After years of playing FFXIV, I decided to join the English forums to share since most information that NA/EU gets about JP servers is from Tonberry/Elemental and they don't seem to know much about Gaia or Mana, but I see now that it's my mistake and I should leave.

Please don't! Your posts have been extremely enlightening and a delight to read, being very well phrased and respectful. Unfortunately there will be always some people who might misinterpret, for a variety of reasons, but how to gain better understanding if not by communicating?

While for your general thoughts on the topic of BA, PUG or premade, and cultural differences in particuar, I found them extremely enlightening, and would like to contribute an observation or three of my own (while agreeing with many of the other things already stated by others here).

Comparing your description of things on Gaia with my own experiences as a German player on a NA server there seems to be a considerable difference in how the average player approaches the game. By and large a considerable chunk of the NA players seem to be at the core solo players who happen to play together with others. Team play, group effort, or even something like group harmony are near-alien concepts, all that matters is individual gain -- clearing an instance as fast as possible, getting the drop you are after, that's it, and doing it in whatever way you personally prefer. To encounter any sense of duty toward others, or the idea of "we are in this boat together", a desire to create a pleasant and enhancing experience for everyone in your team is... rare, at best (of course other players on NA servers might disagree here, I am just stating my own experiences and observations, ymmv).

Actually in all my years on Balmung I have NEVER heard anyone express such an idea as having a duty toward your datacenter/server, and any real group loyalty and sense of duty toward such is also... rare. The only times I ever see something remotely similar said about individual servers is when people make (mostly bad) jokes about Balmung being the server for ERP (cliché, cliché...), or the other way around "Balmungites" feeling some attachment to Balmung due to the RP/FC connections they have made there.

This general observation might also be related to another symptom of different attitudes, cultural differences: The sad fact that the mentor system on NA servers is famous to be a hotbed not of actual mentoring, but instead of people bickering or even trolling (and many I spoke with by now seeing anyone wearing the mentor crown not as someone to approach for advice but a sign of an inflated ego and bad attitude problems). Many people on NA servers seem to lack any desire to teach or to be taught, sad and baffling as this observation is to me. Actually there have been times when I offered polite suggestions during runs with PUGs when I saw someone struggling or lacking even most basic competence at their chosen job (let's say a level 70 WHM casting NOTHING but cure 1 and medica 2) and in return I was severely criticized for doing so, if not downright told "you don't pay my sub". A friend from the US told me later that many US people see any kind of unasked-for "advice" as talking down to them, belittling them, humiliating them in front of others etc., no matter how politely you phrase things (and tbh I was flabbergasted at the very idea -- but yay learning about cultural differences!).

Combining this lack of any teaching "spirit" unless people specifically sign up for it (like in those premades, I guess) with this difference of attitude making an Eureka instance essentially up to 144 solo players who happen to play next to each other it is easy to see (I think) why PUGs in BA can easily lead to disaster, and premades allow for a greater chance of success -- which is in the end all most people on NA servers seem to care about. When I mentioned in shout chat I would be interested in going in "just for fun", to see the place and learn a bit, even if it is obvious from the start we will wipe I was given the feeling of being an alien on the wrong planet ^^; I think it is enlightening that there are jokes going around on NA servers about alliance raids (24 man) meaning you have to play with a "23man debuff" -- the other players are not seen as part of your team, but an obstacle to your path to success. Now to more than double that to what is seen as a "55man debuff" (and in many cases lacking the inclination to "cleanse" that "debuff" through teaching while having some patience and team spirit) and it becomes clear why few people would want to PUG something like BA...

I noticed similar differences in attitude regarding any kind of "competing for resources", which is a real issue on NA servers whenever there is a limited resource (like in this case, portals). People are just not very willing to share, or react with nothing but a bit of disappointment and otherwise good cheer -- more likely there will be lots of rage from at least some. Add to that a considerable amount of -- sad as it is -- trolling and things can go bad very quickly when you create competition between players for such desired resources. I have seen people on Aether who will "snipe" portals as in they will go in and quickly out again for no other reason but to screw with premades, out of pure spite, malice, or the enjoyment of trolling (which makes me honestly very glad the ToS got a bit updated in that regard, to hopefully combat some of the worst behaviors seen on NA servers...). Just one or two trolls like that can really ruin group efforts FAST (we saw that with the EM missions in Diadem already).

It is great that BA seems to work like intended on JP servers, but given the considerable differences in play style and general attitude between JP servers (as I got it from reports like yours, and other people playing on JP servers) and what I observed on Aether makes me think that sadly this type of content is poorly suited for the NA audience in general except with the aid of such things as discord-organized premades, or some form of PF to organize groups, and even then it is... problematic.

Anyway, besides these my lengthy own observations and thoughts, thank you, Epidendrum, for sharing yours here. They brought me much food for thought and are a joy to read ^^

[Kazgrel]

Two weeks after my first attempts to even get into BA and having to wait 2+ hours just to attempt the content, I've given up on ever running this content. I'm having more fun playing other games. BA (and Eureka in general) needs to never happen again. It's the only thing in this game that has given me burnout like this.

[Kuroka]

Personally I'm an ethnic Chinese Singaporean, fluent in English, Chinese, Indonesian, Japanese and German.

Warte du sprichst auch noch deutsch?? Und ich fand das englisch schon sehr gut/angenehm zu lesen^^


But yes i have to chime in there, pls dont leave, youre insights are rly interresting, I'm sure many others would miss that too.

[Lacan]

I'd just like to know why so many SAMs die in BA. Most of the time when the dust settles after the first two bosses there will be numerous dead SAMs on the floor. We have to leave a lot of them behind. Do the mechanics deal more damage to SAMs or something? Sometimes they even die to the trash in the hallways.

[Jxnibbles]

It is very annoying being forced to wait 3-5 hours to get a 9 min pull to do the only boss that matters because Aether. The way BA is implemented so far is very frustrating. So glad I got my clear once my friends get it I will never go inside that place again.

[Valkyrie_Lenneth]

I'd just like to know why so many SAMs die in BA. Most of the time when the dust settles after the first two bosses there will be numerous dead SAMs on the floor. We have to leave a lot of them behind. Do the mechanics deal more damage to SAMs or something? Sometimes they even die to the trash in the hallways.

Probably something to do with people believing just because they are in a discord pre-made means they know what they are doing.

[Rowde]

I'd just like to know why so many SAMs die in BA. Most of the time when the dust settles after the first two bosses there will be numerous dead SAMs on the floor. We have to leave a lot of them behind. Do the mechanics deal more damage to SAMs or something? Sometimes they even die to the trash in the hallways.

Believe it or not... many melee made it through 4 Eureka zones and find their way into BA without ever realizing that they can ignore positionals on Eureka monsters...

[Adrestia]

I wasn't exactly sure who to begin with quoting, because some of the opinions I'm responding to have been expressed repeatedly in this thread and others, so I'll just speak a bit more broadly.

This concept that NA servers lack players willing to teach is absolutely false
The NA servers are full of people who are willing to provide help to players of all skill levels. Whether it's novice network discussions about where the next quest is or how to AoE, or people in places like The Balance offering to take time out of their day to look over your parses and help you see your strengths and weaknesses, or the numerous content creators making text guides such as the one for BA or video guides for everything from dungeons to ultimate raids, these people deserve our appreciation.

More specifically, I can log onto the Aether BA Discord and be presented with links to guides, strategy images, chat channels full of people willing to explain mechanics, and LFG tools designed to get anyone who wants to into BA in a group appropriate to their level of experience. These people have set up a huge amount of infrastructure to make all our lives easier.

For people to post in threads like these about Glorious Japan and what a dumpster fire NA servers are is just incredibly unappreciative. Don't spread the idea that people aren't helpful because they don't define themselves by the number of super kawaii Japanese emoticons they post or how much they prattle on about the sacred duty of the mentor crown. There's an absolute litany of English-language help, created by "Western" players, many of whom are extremely nice and approachable. These people are working hard to increase the general competency level of the entire population of their datacenters so that we can all have less facepalm deaths and more fun.

What the NA servers lack is a broad culture of being willing to learn.
For many reasons, a number of them asinine, the overall population of the NA servers is, as you said, solo players who happen to be in the same world as others. They aren't thinking about bringing themselves up to a competency level that makes the experience of playing on these servers better for everyone. They are thinking solely of their own gameplay experience and not how it affects those around them.

I won't claim that the reason for these differences is based on a culture defined by nationality. As a poster above mentioned, the servers located in Japan are geographically the best-located servers for people from dozens of disparate real-world cultures. There is absolutely no reason to sit here and espouse how great Japan is and how terrible the rest of the world is unless you're looking for hi5s from other people in the same echo chamber. People all over the world have something to offer, and areas to improve. I believe that the current state (read as: low skill level and high selfishness of a large portion of the population) of the NA servers is attributable primarily to socialization within Eorzea and the other online worlds we've shared. Although as I said above there are many amazing people working to the benefit of all of us, there are also plenty of examples of people who have given up on teaching after being snapped at by "you don't pay my sub" types.

We need to give up this superiority complex of JP vs NA, FFXI vs WoW (and EQ and RIFT and UO and every other MMO that Squaresoft didn't make). Instead of trying to discount the views of vast swaths of people because of where they were born or what games they have enjoyed or critiqued over the years, listen to each person based on their own merits. And let's give a hearty thank you to the dozens if not hundreds of NA/EU content creators who are producing guides and other media for us to learn from and enjoy.

[Epidendrum]

Like the poster above me, I'm not sure who to start quoting as well. I thought quite a bit during my work breaks yesterday and decided how to best frame my next post to the discussion here.

Danke! Ich muss noch viel lernen...

Firstly. thanks to everyone who is posting here. I think the amount of feedback makes SE notice something isn't right.

After much thought on how to post a neutral, or at least non-culture-comparative and constructive discussion point, I believe the question I want to ask is this: Given the varied reactions to the arsenal, and this is a feedback topic. How can SE best implement content for a large amount of players in future that is region agnostic? Or phrased in a slightly different way, is it possible to make game content that is truly global and with a certain degree of longevity?

I've seen replies that entry to the arsenal are contentious to say the least and others suggest to make it PF/DF. PF/DF has its own issues as well, due to different regions responding differently to using them. So, I'm not sure if that would be a viable solution.

As for the experience in the arsenal I can think of two ways to improve it without affecting the challenge too much.

First, the support fate. We know Tristitia is tied to Absolute Virtue(AV). Defeating it weakens AV significantly. I would propose making the AV chest's 6 fragments be split if the group outside in Hydatos completes the fate. People outside get 3, those inside are left with 3 when they open the chest. Now, what if the support fate fails? I would say, if Tristitia's 15 min fate timer runs out, AV still has a buff but greatly reduced. It will still be beatable but harder than normal. Meanwhile in Hydatos, Tristitia will roam as a very dangerous monster with true sight, but otherwise is a mob with a large amount of exp for killing it. Lore wise I would explain it AV having to use aether to maintain two forms while it is in mortal danger from the teams inside the arsenal. In this case, if the arsenal teams manage to kill the harder but slightly less buffed AV, they keep all 6 fragments. My idea is that, rather than just increase the support fate's reward, make it a sharing/splitting of the AV fragments, to create a sense of shared contribution. It's not just "if I do the support fate, I get rewards.", but rather "if I complete the support fate, the arsenal folks split the reward with me 50-50." If the people outside really don't want to help, those inside still have a fighting chance this way. There are also implications for not helping - a non fate Tristitia roaming Hydatos until killed, or the instance ends. Shared pain, shared reward.

The other idea I have is related to Ozma. We can't raise in the arsenal due to aether from the weapons. I propose that if Ozma is killed, players who are dead but not yet ejected due to black hole, (1) get the achievement, (2) can now be raised normally, meaning also that they get to click the final chest. I think lore wise it makes sense to remove the "Cannot raise normally" debuff as all weapons are defeated, and also encourages players to really give their all in the fight and not lose hope if they die. The rest of the players can attempt a race to defeat Ozma before the next black hole in order to preserve rewards and a clear for their party members.