Petition to ban Moogle exploiters.

[TheVedis]

I personally don't see it as THAT much of an exploit.. for god's sake the Moogle king himself rez's his whole party once he 2hrs.. why shouldn't we?

I also don't understand why people are making a huge stink about it.. For cereal...

for the same reason people make a stink about the faction NM exploit

and the same people of course defend it(those who use it)


now i havent bothered with moogle yet, and correct me if im wrong, but my understanding is this

people are using a zombie tactic, which lets them die, and continue the fight, BUT not everything agros them when they restart it? Thus letting them pick and choose targets til the fight is done

if this is the case, its an exploit, and there is no ifs ands or butts about it


if they still have to immediately re-engage everything, its not an exploit, its just a zombie tactic that many games use

[darkstarpoet1]

for the same reason people make a stink about the faction NM exploit

and the same people of course defend it(those who use it)


now i havent bothered with moogle yet, and correct me if im wrong, but my understanding is this

people are using a zombie tactic, which lets them die, and continue the fight, BUT not everything agros them when they restart it? Thus letting them pick and choose targets til the fight is done

if this is the case, its an exploit, and there is no ifs ands or butts about it


if they still have to immediately re-engage everything, its not an exploit, its just a zombie tactic that many games use

what happens is if the party is about to wipe as long as someone has a raise and stands up before the last person dies and doesn't move they get no aggro. arrgo goes to 0 on death. they can stand up and raise his party and as long as they don't move everyone can rebuff.

once they re-engage the moogle though the entire moogle group aggro's again. they do not get to pick just one moogle at a time. i personally won't use the method because i want my first win to be completely legit to me and not fighting the mob for 5 minutes is not what i consider right, but it is part of the game mechanics just like raising a person during ifrit wouldn't get eruptions on them for a while because they no longer are on the hate meter.

there's groups that have been doing this on the song to insta die while casting raise on each other and when they all die they can stand up as long as 1 is still standing. that i am not a fan of, but there's no way for se to know the difference between that and a group getting close to the end and the party dying while they are getting multiple members up not exploiting. i can't think of a way se could punish the people intentionally dying to the song without punishing the groups that are attempting to do things legit.

[TheVedis]

what happens is if the party is about to wipe as long as someone has a raise and stands up before the last person dies and doesn't move they get no aggro. arrgo goes to 0 on death. they can stand up and raise his party and as long as they don't move everyone can rebuff.

once they re-engage the moogle though the entire moogle group aggro's again. they do not get to pick just one moogle at a time. i personally won't use the method because i want my first win to be completely legit to me and not fighting the mob for 5 minutes is not what i consider right, but it is part of the game mechanics just like raising a person during ifrit wouldn't get eruptions on them for a while because they no longer are on the hate meter.

there's groups that have been doing this on the song to insta die while casting raise on each other and when they all die they can stand up as long as 1 is still standing. that i am not a fan of, but there's no way for se to know the difference between that and a group getting close to the end and the party dying while they are getting multiple members up not exploiting. i can't think of a way se could punish the people intentionally dying to the song without punishing the groups that are attempting to do things legit.

that doesnt sound like an exploit to me, thats a zombie strat which is legit in every game i can think of

the real drawback of it of course being the time you lose in the fight in order to do it


i was hearing some people tell me that there was a way to do it where not everything would even fight you when you restart, now THAT would be an exploit if it was used


this dates back to the older examples of faction NM abuse vs leve failing, where 1 was an obvious exploit and the other was just game mechanics being used to ones advantage

in this case, agro mechanics are being used to keep the fight going, of course it can be easily fixed by changing the moogles agro detection, and im sure thatl happen if SE isnt happy with it, but as long as its not an actual bug with the fight itself(such as the moogles not fighting when they should be after re-engaging) then it should be ok

[darkstarpoet1]

that doesnt sound like an exploit to me, thats a zombie strat which is legit in every game i can think of

the real drawback of it of course being the time you lose in the fight in order to do it


i was hearing some people tell me that there was a way to do it where not everything would even fight you when you restart, now THAT would be an exploit if it was used


this dates back to the older examples of faction NM abuse vs leve failing, where 1 was an obvious exploit and the other was just game mechanics being used to ones advantage

in this case, agro mechanics are being used to keep the fight going, of course it can be easily fixed by changing the moogles agro detection, and im sure thatl happen if SE isnt happy with it, but as long as its not an actual bug with the fight itself(such as the moogles not fighting when they should be after re-engaging) then it should be ok

as far as i am aware there is not a way to raise and attack one mob at a time. that said, won't use it until i get at least my first win the old fashioned way so i haven't tired any of those other methods.

the only thing i've seen people talk about was once they raise and everyone buffs take out the mages first. that keeps the rest of the moogle group unable to heal themselves the rest of the fight so they can just blast away at the mele moogles without them healing up and getting the bard songs put on them. that way if they die again after the mages once they get up it's a pure zerg after that point.

i'm not saying there's not a way to raise up and attack one mob at a time, but if there is then i am not aware of it.

edit: i'll say from the streams of the fight in which people used this strat you better be on your game after getting up because you will be hard pressed to complete the fight in the time frame if you use this strategy and are slow at dps.

[TheVedis]

as far as i am aware there is not a way to raise and attack one mob at a time. that said, won't use it until i get at least my first win the old fashioned way so i haven't tired any of those other methods.

the only thing i've seen people talk about was once they raise and everyone buffs take out the mages first. that keeps the rest of the moogle group unable to heal themselves the rest of the fight so they can just blast away at the mele moogles without them healing up and getting the bard songs put on them. that way if they die again after the mages once they get up it's a pure zerg after that point.

i'm not saying there's not a way to raise up and attack one mob at a time, but if there is then i am not aware of it.

edit: i'll say from the streams of the fight in which people used this strat you better be on your game after getting up because you will be hard pressed to complete the fight in the time frame if you use this strategy and are slow at dps.

yeah sounds legit to me then, thats a poor mans strategy sure, and not the most exciting way to win the fight, but it is legal and not an exploit

[darkstarpoet1]

yeah sounds legit to me then, thats a poor mans strategy sure, and not the most exciting way to win the fight, but it is legal and not an exploit

yeah, it reminds me of the first time a party i was in beat dodore. there was a party there and they got down to the dodore and one minion and then they wiped. my party jumped on there fast to attack it. i refused to have my first win tarnished because my first win would have been against a weakened mob.

i was the only healer so i told them i wasn't going to get a win like that and if they attacked it like that i'd just not heal the party. sure, some got mad, but others agreed to wait and let the other group come back and try it again. the group did wind up beating it and they stood aside and let us kill the next pop since we waited on them.

we did kill it when it repopped and it felt much more rewarding because we beat the whole thing than it would have if we had beaten just the dodore and 1 minion. remember though that was back before they nerfed the dodore and it still had the full group of minions and not the 4 it got reduced to as well as before everyone found out how op emulate was.

i guess, what i am saying is that i don't blame anyone for using the strategy to beat it, but i just want my first kill to be completely on the up and up so i feel more rewarded after beating it. to me there is nothing illegal about using the raise strategy, but that strategy just isn't for me.