Artoirel is... (4.5 spoilers)

[Iscah]

Hmm... of course he also casually strolls past the aevises roaming that section so I wonder if there's a discrepancy between what would be roaming that area in 'reality' vs what we see scripted in game.

Hmm... could be that the war is over and the aevises are no longer aggressive! (They've stopped attacking us, right?)

Either that or the time bubble is doing strange things to us, and we're still in Lv40 pre-Heavensward Coerthas while he's walking through Lv60 post-Heavensward Coerthas where the dragons have all withdrawn and it's perfectly safe.

Or maybe he's got hidden talents and the aevises won't attack him because he's a high-leveled... something. He is technically wearing Lv49 mage gear and Lv50 crafter gear.

[Wyssahtyn]

The aevises were probably eradicated, assuming they've no cognitive ability left, since Ishgard would likely have the manpower to spare with such an operation due to the conclusion of the Dragonsong War. Or we can go with the very simple explanation that Francel arrives with an escort that isn't rendered for what is, for all purposes, a one-off event that triggers on approach.

[Kalise]

Maybe the Aevis can sense the immense sadness in Francel as he approaches and they can relate, due to sadness being a driving force for Nidhogg's rage and then because they're no longer under his thrall they don't have that rage overshadowing all other emotion and so don't feel as though they should be aggressive towards him.

Meanwhile, they'll attack the WoL because the last moments of Nidhogg's life would have been pure malice directed towards them which might still linger.

#headcannon

[Skeith9]

I love how SE throws in hidden dialogue like this. I replay to try and find some. Thanks for the info, next time I'm at the quest I'll check Ishgard!

[Iscah]

Maybe the Aevis can sense the immense sadness in Francel as he approaches and they can relate, due to sadness being a driving force for Nidhogg's rage and then because they're no longer under his thrall they don't have that rage overshadowing all other emotion and so don't feel as though they should be aggressive towards him.

Meanwhile, they'll attack the WoL because the last moments of Nidhogg's life would have been pure malice directed towards them which might still linger.

#headcannon

They don't attack us any more though - by the time we've reached Heavensward, let alone finished it, we're high-leveled enough that they ignore us.

Aggressive enemies don't attack you if you're more than ten levels above them. Thus my earlier suggestion that Francel is likewise high-leveled enough in some kind of skill to walk straight past them!


Also, pedantic spelling, but "canon" (the established version of events) is spelt differently to "cannon" (a large mounted gun). A "head cannon" is probably not a good idea. :P

[Iscah]

I love how SE throws in hidden dialogue like this. I replay to try and find some. Thanks for the info, next time I'm at the quest I'll check Ishgard!

I agree! It can be hard to track down everything that happens.

The quest database at Garland Tools is really good for this, because the "talk dialogue" tab will record these sorts of dialogue changes. It's particularly worthwhile reading through the final quest of each MSQ or patch, as those can affect characters in a lot of places. Though of course it's also fun to do it 'in person'!

One time I even found a "deleted scene" in the text there, but I can't find it again now which I tracked down and posted below.

[Kalise]

Also, pedantic spelling, but "canon" (the established version of events) is spelt differently to "cannon" (a large mounted gun). A "head cannon" is probably not a good idea. :P

#WordsAreHard

Also, a Head Cannon is a great idea. I'll get my best gobbies on the design right away ;D

[Iscah]

Aha, found the "deleted scene" I mentioned earlier.

The last section of the script for the quest Heavensward doesn't seem to be in the game - I'd gone through it shortly before finding this the first time, and again just the other day with my second alt, and didn't find it either time. So it's either removed or bizarrely hard to find, because I do try to talk to everyone important before moving onto the next quest objective.

Edmont mentions "the ceremony" which would have been Ishgard's induction into the Alliance during the first part of the credits. So I assume it was supposed to be a post-credits scene, probably at the manor, similar to your return to the Waking Sands after ARR's credits.

I think you do still end up there afterwards, but only Alphinaud and Tataru are there. I hope they didn't just forget to put the other characters in there after writing the script for them!

EDMONT
During the ceremony, I felt Haurchefant's presence. He was watching us from on high, with pride in his eyes and that customary smile on his lips...

AYMERIC
Allow me to thank you─not as the lord commander of the Temple Knights, but as a humble citizen of Ishgard.
Though you came to us an outsider, you risked all to bring us this chance for change. And we will not squander it, I swear to you. We will rise above the ashes of our dark past and rebuild our nation upon a foundation of truth and equality.

LUCIA
You are a true hero, my friend. The minstrels shall sing of your deeds for generations to come.

HILDA
Seein' you flyin' in on dragonback helped put things in perspective. If man and dragon can be friends, how hard can it be for us to get along with each other?
To be sure, it'll take time and effort to bridge the gulf between highborn and lowborn, but I'm confident it'll all work out in the end.

EMMANELLAIN
You are the talk of the Holy See, my friend! And by association, I like to think that I am too!

ARTOIREL
Though Haurchefant is gone, his spirit lives on within us all.
For my part, I shall strive to be a knight worthy of the name. Pray watch over me, brother!

[AmemeAmeklin]

I do remember that dialogue, actually...and I don't make a habit of reading Garland Tools so I likely found it in game.

I don't think it's a deleted scene. The NPCs are scattered around Ishgard, so you have to roam around looking for them. Not sure about Aymeric, though. It might have been when we were saying our goodbyes before heading to Azys Lla.

There were actually a couple ceremonies that I remember. Ishgard joining the Alliance was not actually in the credits at the end...we had that whole Eorzean Alliance mock military battle after that (after the failed peace conference), and then at the very end in the credits, we had Ishgard properly allied with Hraesvelgr's brood. I could be remembering wrong, of course, because it's way past my bedtime... XD

[Iscah]

I do remember that dialogue, actually...and I don't make a habit of reading Garland Tools so I likely found it in game.

Interesting. It's possibly only available if you speak to them inbetween completing the Heavensward quest and picking up the first 3.1 quest immediately after?

Although it seems odd for a few other reasons - particularly that there doesn't seem to be a location listed for Edmont or Aymeric (under 'Involved NPCs' in the Stats tab) for that quest, and also that it's generally unusual for Edmont to be standing around in town. His NPC data only shows locations at the manor or in Aymeric's office, and none of them seem to be either linked to the quest or saying those lines.

I did have a feeling I'd seen Lucia and Hilda's lines elsewhere, and looking through the rest of the script, they do have those same lines earlier - along with what I do remember Artoirel and Emmanellain (and Honoroit) saying.

That's another odd thing there - no alternate line for Honoroit, and his earlier one was in direct response to Emmanellain's.


If they are there but just easily missable, it's a pity. Edmont and Artoirel's lines are particularly important, I think, in the progression of their stories and the grief we see them going through earlier. And Aymeric's thankyou is a nice character moment as well.


Will have to make a mental note to search extra-hard at whatever future point I take my last alt through the story.... which will not be for quite some time. Replaying it once was good, but a second time so soon feels like a bit much.