Blue mage at patch 4.5

[Oridan]

I still hope not. We got 2 DPS last time. We need a healer and a tank this time.

Yep, I'll concede that.

[Awful]

So you are saying that you prefer to be forced into another class for ALL content, instead of SOME content. That's illogical no matter how I look at it. I prefer to play what I like in some stuff than no stuff. I don't know, maybe I'm just the weird sort that prefers to be half-sated than starving, even though I'd prefer to be sated fully?!

You're missing the point here what if people want to main and raid as a BLU? People have been wanting that for so long their favorite class, into content that they enjoy whether it be Raiding, PvP, Ultimate, Trials, I could go on but when you forcibly tell people that they have to reroll as another class then people get upset. It's fine if you have friends and can que together then yeah that's awesome, but for a solo class to do things at the end of the game like farm Tomes or maybe the next relic grind which'll be another huge area (in other words match making) and they are gated because they are a BLU and have to play something else it isn't right.

You have to think about the freedom that this game gives you, how you can level, how you can que for a dungeon, do FATEs, and hit mobs that's all you can do where another class like a tank or healer who gets faster ques get in instantly and can move along faster. Unless BLU can actively chain mobs quickly and rack up a lot of EXP then it's going to be a slog, you're also losing 50/60 roulette, leveling roulette, and so on to help you level you'll literally be grinding mobs for hours when you could just do a dungeon.

You have your own opinions and I have mine just the way this games combat, leveling, endgame experiences shouldn't be left to your class or the restrictions it should be the players choice and should play what they like whether it be alone or group.

[Fyce]

you'll literally be grinding mobs for hours when you could just do a dungeon.

But you can do dungeons with a BLU... Just setup a PF "BLU party dungeon exp! We will take turns for who needs to tank/heal!" and that's it.
That's literally all you have to do. (Except for the 15 first levels, of course.)

[Awful]

you need to already have a Lv50 battle job, and finished 2.0. Sure, they are not heavy requirements, but it means that you can't choose BLU as a starting job like you suggested. You just got told to get your facts straight, but you still missed something...

Read my edited post I corrected myself as they posted it since I was re watching the fanfest you know read the edited part?

Also, you use the argument of players not being able to go into endgame content because they'd have leveled up through open world content... but that's ignoring the fact that you can very much to dungeons with other people (just not in random grouping through DF). Besides, what do you mean "end game content" when the job is capped at 50?

The issue is the game doesn't tell you to use PF it tells you to use DF to find groups for dungeons and tells you about the rewards for queing with adventurer in need, and there is no open world content unless it's FATEs, the same boring content we've had since 2.0? What thrilling open world building content. They said they will continue to increase the cap what I'm saying is because you can't access it (being level 50) you can't do any endgame or roulettes so please read.

You are also very much assuming that BLU won't be introduced to players as a very special job, with its own specific content and mechanics. Like that job will be shown as any other just to trick new players into thinking that this is how the game is played. Why are you assuming that? The game already has a sh*tload of tutorials and information bubbles dedicated into explaining side-content to players. There's no reason to think that BLU won't be disclosed as such.

It might or it might not be, it could just be "this is BLU, here is quest guy, it is a limited job meaning it takes part in solo play" we don't know yet so you can't really say what's gonna happen here till it happens for now they basically said they could have balanced it around the core game but they didn't. I'm also not assuming anything at all I'm just saying what has been said you are gated since you cannot partake in any kind of endgame or even the xpac at launch and the leveling experience is flawed since it's nothing innovative. The way BLU is advertised is a side content job and I'm gonna stick by that since it is a limited job and can't take part in any of the later stuff unless they tweak it down the road.

[Burningskull]

I think what Awful is trying to say is. Say you pick Thamaturge / Black Mage to start the game with. You get to lvl 15 and you're introduced to the Duty Finder and your first dungeon. Now it's been a while since I've started the game but I don't believe you're ever "introduced" to the Party Finder. That person then uses the Duty Finder every time they get a new dungeon all the way up to lvl 50. They probably even spammed dungeons to level as well. I did... Anyway they get to 50 and now there is a quest that opens up allowing them to play the Blue Mage. They do the quest, get to level 15, go to try to use the Duty Finder to grind dungeons to level but can't do it. Now they have to ask around or go on the internet, provided the game didn't tell them when they unlocked the job, to find out that they can't queue into the Duty Finder. They either grind regular mobs and probably fates. Or they figure out how to use Party Finder and either sit in it waiting for a generous tank / healer / other dps (probably another Blu) to help with the dungeon, which would probably take hours considering there is nothing in it for tanks and healers to do low level dungeons since you only get tomes and such from the Duty Finder, or shout in the hub areas for a party like people do in Eureka.

Now lets say they stick with it and get to lvl 50. Assuming that this is their 2nd job they have leveled just after getting their first job to level 50, they are not told they can't go into Heavensward and level to 60. They can only do anything level 50. which is Binding Coils and some Extreme Primals that most people only do unsynced for WT. So even if you do the primals you are still going to be a lvl 50 with a bunch of level 70s killing the thing probably faster than you need to see the move you are trying to learn.

In conclusion Blu is not being designed as a job that's intended to be played the way everything else is be playing. It's a job that's there for players who have already been through the content on another job and just need something to do in their downtime. Which is bad design when people want to take Blu "through" the content when the content is relevant. Not A patch or SEVERAL patches later.

[Dyvid]

FFXIV is basically a game of parties fighting a boss so a solo job is a real head scratchier. True it was fun to people in a solo Final Fantasy game going around learning enemy skills to use against the final boss but... you used Blue Mage in the final boss fight. We don't have a ton of open world solo content. I just don't get it. Sadly this looks like another Lord of Vermillion content fluke; good idea but poor delivery.

[kikix12]

You're missing the point here what if people want to main and raid as a BLU?

I want to have a class that consists of casting the limit breaks for free, with a godmode on.

Seriously. "What if the people want (...)" is an irksome argument at this point. It was said from the VERY BEGINNING that this class CANNOT come into FFXIV without limitations to it. There was a choice of making a different class and slapping the name "Blue Mage" on it, or making a Blue Mage and limiting it. They chose the second option. The better option, actually, because going forward they CAN make this class work in more things. Doing the reverse would be a lot harder. Once it would have lost its identity but still be accepted, you'd have an army of people against it regaining that identity because they'd like the fake Blue Mage. And rightfully so.

You have to think about the freedom that this game gives you (...)

Ironic coming from someone with your arguments, because you argue AGAINST that freedom. The part of that freedom is switching classes on the fly. You are against using that. You don't want freedom. You want to go along a single, definite line. Part of "freedom" is the necessity to deal with the consequences on your own. In this case...it means that some classes may not be available for everything. In a normal MMO without the freedom to change classes this would be unacceptable, but it IS acceptable here BECAUSE you have the freedom.

Also, you can level in the same way. Again. Only PvP and Deep Dungeon are unavailable. And there is no faster queue than instant queue. You get instant queue when having pre-made party, while dungeons are on of the fastest leveling methods in the game. Not deep dungeon. Palace of the Dead at low to mid levels SUCKS. It's just easier to enter as a DPS, though not even that is true anymore.

Not to mention, PvP is separate on other classes already so it's rather likely they WILL allow Blue Mage in PvP somewhere down the line no matter how it's PvE side will continue.

You have your own opinions and I have mine just the way this games combat, leveling, endgame experiences shouldn't be left to your class or the restrictions it should be the players choice and should play what they like whether it be alone or group.

Yes, opinions. And I have no intention of trying to change opinions by force nor call them wrong. However you are not using opinions alone. "Not being able to level like other classes" is not an opinion. It's a statement of a fact. But it is mostly wrong. Plain and simple. I am only discussing those matters where you do NOT bring up opinions. Don't like it?! That's your choice. Try to make it to be something else than it really is?! I'm going to point at it and call you wrong in that, because you are at the points I am discussing with you.

[Fyce]

Read my edited post I corrected myself as they posted it since I was re watching the fanfest you know read the edited part?

The issue is the game doesn't tell you to use PF it tells you to use DF to find groups for dungeons and tells you about the rewards for queing with adventurer in need, and there is no open world content unless it's FATEs, the same boring content we've had since 2.0? What thrilling open world building content. They said they will continue to increase the cap what I'm saying is because you can't access it (being level 50) you can't do any endgame or roulettes so please read.

It might or it might not be, it could just be "this is BLU, here is quest guy, it is a limited job meaning it takes part in solo play" we don't know yet so you can't really say what's gonna happen here till it happens for now they basically said they could have balanced it around the core game but they didn't. I'm also not assuming anything at all I'm just saying what has been said you are gated since you cannot partake in any kind of endgame or even the xpac at launch and the leveling experience is flawed since it's nothing innovative. The way BLU is advertised is a side content job and I'm gonna stick by that since it is a limited job and can't take part in any of the later stuff unless they tweak it down the road.

Your only argument is only about very new players being unable to read tutorials and understand what the PF is, even after finishing 2.0 and leveled a job to 50.
That's an extremely niche concern to have, especially if you have to assume that the game won't disclose how BLU works and why it's different to new players.
You also completly ignore tools like the Novice network where new players can ask questions about things they don't understand.

That's litteraly the weakest argument against how BLU will be in FFXIV in this entire thread.

Anyway they get to 50 and now there is a quest that opens up allowing them to play the Blue Mage. They do the quest, get to level 15, go to try to use the Duty Finder to grind dungeons to level but can't do it. Now they have to ask around or go on the internet, provided the game didn't tell them when they unlocked the job, to find out that they can't queue into the Duty Finder.

That quest can simply start by "Blue Mage is a limited job. Limited jobs are submitted to restrictions regular jobs don't have, and have special content as well as gameplay attached to them. Please, read this tutorial about Blue Mages. [Tutorial opens]".
Problem solved.

In conclusion Blu is not being designed as a job that's intended to be played the way everything else is be playing. It's a job that's there for players who have already been through the content on another job and just need something to do in their downtime. [...]

Exactly. It's simply side content.

[...]Which is bad design when people want to take Blu "through" the content when the content is relevant. Not A patch or SEVERAL patches later.

That, on the other hand, is only your own opinion. You can't do "relevant content" with your Squadron. It didn't prevent this side content to exists and be enjoyed by some people.
You say "people want to take BLU in relevant content". Who are you to say what everyone wants? I, for instance, couldn't care less about not being able to raid with a BLU, and I appreciate the system they came up with to make it feel like a true and iconic Blue Mage. So, speak for yourself and yourself only, please.
Besides, we already knew since 4 years ago how BLU was going to be. Or, more to the point, not to be.

[Awful]

Snip.

You really have to look at the big picture here you're saying that my arguments go against freedom? It really doesn't there are people who want to level through PvP and there are still people here today that do it's pretty effective and breaks up the tediousness of leveling, guess what BLU can't do? Same with PotD so many people rushed Rdm and Sam because the ques were bad and was optimal to level by doing 50-60 floors so they could continue on with SB MSQ so they wouldn't be left behind, guess what level BLU is stuck at? 50.

To me you're saying that I am removing freedom when in reality it's SE where they limit you because it's a "limited" job (see what I did there) BLU is limited to what it can be apart of, limited to how it can level, limited to how it gets abilities, limited to how you can level it. Don't point fingers at me when SE is the one who chose to how you can level this class and how it interacts with how the core game is which guess what, the endgame is indeed Tome grinding and roulettes as well as whatever optional content that needs matchmaking which is an issue if people don't have premades and wanna play solo.

I'm not using facts, I am using what's given to me and how the state of the game is currently and how going forward with this experiment isn't going to create a desirable experience for a lot of people who are displeased with myself being one of them I'm just voicing how with all these things I said are issues that SE have made for everyone.

[Saefinn]

The issue is the game doesn't tell you to use PF it tells you to use DF to find groups for dungeons and tells you about the rewards for queing with adventurer in need, and there is no open world content unless it's FATEs, the same boring content we've had since 2.0? What thrilling open world building content. They said they will continue to increase the cap what I'm saying is because you can't access it (being level 50) you can't do any endgame or roulettes so please read.

We could potentially see Party Finder used more with Blue Mages wanting to hook up. Potentially it could be where it get more love. But I've generally found it's use for gathering people for endgame stuff. I think in a better case scenario, the restiction would essentially be you can do any piece of content as long as you don't use the duty finder, whilst inconvenient, it would not be horrible (plus, if you can roulette as a pre-made with a BLU, I think that would help a lot too). You may well end up with some parties of only Blue Mages this way hanging out on the Party Finder, it could be non-Blue Mages pick up on that and join said party finder groups. But I guess SE is being cautious as it is a departure from normal jobs and could cause too many problems if not in check.

Whilst I get that the game doesn't do much to push the party finder, I think if you wanted to level Blue Mage, you'd become more acutely aware of its benefit. Plus it does get used for content and there is a message every so often in your chat window telling you how many party finder parties match your criteria at the moment, so whilst not pushed, I expect awareness to come quickly and a reminder of its existence to be common.