[4.4 Discussion] "Change the Future"

[ObsidianFire]

Y'shtola's actions at the House of the Crooked Coin did not cause the depleted aether in Othard or Eorzia. Y'shtola specifically brings up crystals loosing their aetheric charge before she and Hein even go to the Steppe.

Manipulating aether at the House of the Crooked Coin has a long and storied history. Y'shtola is simply the last person to manipulate the aether there and she's probably the most benevolent person to do it. Both in motive and in effect.

The first time aether is manipulated at the House of the Crooked Coin is all the way back in the 3rd Astral Era. Someone (and we have enough information to make a good guess of who it was; it's probably Amon or an Allagan scientist working with him) uses the crystal to stop the flow of all aether to the Burn. This makes the land lifeless and perfect for hacking off pieces of it and floating it using the crystal's aether. This happens sometime before the Allagan war with Mercydia ends as the lore book makes mention of experiments developed in Azys Lla being used in that war. Most importantly, the flow of aether of aether to the Burn is never restored.

The second time, the crystal is used to get Dalamud into orbit. Again, it's probably Amon (or people working with him) who does this. This is after the war with Mercydia. And still the aether to the Burn isn't restored.

After this, five thousand years and three Calamities go by. This entire time, the Burn has gone without aether. During this time, Solus comes across it and says this is what happens when too many primals get summoned. Yeah right.

The third (and probably last) time aether is manipulated at the House of the Crooked Coin is by Y'shtola. And it's specifically to restore the flow of aether to the Burn. She's finally fixing an imbalance in the world's aether that has been around for 5,000 years.

[LineageRazor]

I'm certainly seeing Varis in a new light, now, and I'm extremely curious as to HOW LONG he knew that his grandfather was an Ascian. Was he raised from a child with this knowledge, or did he only find out once Elidibus moved in? If he was previously aware, it lends a new layer to his shock at seeing Elidibus wearing his son's face: by taking the body of the heir apparent, the Ascians are clearly gearing up to personally take the reins of Galemand once again.

Varis is also clearly not too pleased with the Ascians' use of him and the empire, and yet seems unwilling to do anything about it. I'm wondering if we're looking at another Thordan situation here, where he believes that if the truth was revealed, the terrible knowledge would destroy his nation. And so, he sees himself as being in a damned-if-you-do, damned-if-you-don't situation: Either he sits idly by and allows the Ascians to use his nation as a machine to spread discord, or he acts against them and dooms that same country to destruction. And, being Varis, the rest of the world can go to Hell - Garlemand is the only important thing. But it is galling, nonetheless.

After this, five thousand years and three Calamities go by. This entire time, the Burn has gone without aether. During this time, Solus comes across it and says this is what happens when too many primals get summoned. Yeah right.

I want to point out that both theories may be correct. Primals may have depleted the landscape, and the Allagan's manipulations prevented Aether from flowing back in to restore it. Certainly, it suited Solus's designs to omit the latter part, no doubt.

[BellaRiddle]

I believe VERY STRONGLY that the voice we heard in our heads was Arbert's.

Minfilia probably reached out to our word and let his voice come through to warn us that we're making the same mistake they did (since we're about to go on full-blown offensive mode against the ascians) - Basically, they are meaning to warn us that if we kill the ascians, our world is done for, burned by the light's radiance, in the same fashion his were.

I also believe that the fellows who are now taking a long nap were brought to the WoD's world, in a manner very much alike the one the WoD troupe was brought here - soul only. It's quite possible that while they were in Hydaelyn, their physical bodies over at their world were in a similar comatose state.

Any thoughts?

[Anonymoose]

Any thoughts?

Since you very strongly believe the very thing that fell off of my "most likely" list, I suppose I'll put forth the considerations that I couldn't make fit.

Let's skip right over "none of the people who would have been transported to the First have Crystals of Light through which to make the journey." Maybe if Minfilia's doing it you don't need them, eh? So Minfilia mimics Hydaelyn's soul-call ability and leaves us ... elsewhere.

"That way...sorrow."
Thancred's go a bad plan. Ok.

"History...must be changed..."
Need to redirect the flow of events. Got it.

"Ahead looms a Calamity. Ahead looms Light, expunging all form and life. Twin dooms only you can forestall. Only you."
Alright, our first variables. Is one going to hit and then the other? Or could either hit and we have to walk between them? I'm guessing if you're guessing this is Arbert, the latter?

"Let expanse contract, eon become instant..."
Come again? Why does Arbert want to change the laws of space and time as his solution to this problem?

"Throw wide the gates that we may pass!"
Come again!? When did Arbert gain the ability to make time and space bend before him!?
What gate does he need to be let through? If Minfilia called me here, and he's still got his Crystal of Light, get it done, right?

And why doesn't Arbert sound like Arbert in Japanese?

[Nalien]

And why doesn't Arbert sound like Arbert in Japanese?

Well the English voice cast has changed fairly frequently for a number of reasons, resulting in characters getting new voice actors (Yugiri tragically being the most recent afaik), I'd say that'd be the most obvious answer. Unless of course the Japanese voice actor for Arbert is still actively voicing other characters.

That said, I'm leaning towards future Alphinaud... The only thing throwing me off that is the last line; "Throw wide the gates that we may pass!", Zodiark I assume would be singular, the Warriors of Darkness could throw out a 'we' though... Then again so could Alphinaud, if the plan is for the Scions from the worst timeline to swap places with the current Scions, hence the soul extraction... Of course it could just be the royal 'we', but the more I thought about future Alphinaud trying to stop Skynet a Flood of Light, the more I liked the idea... Obviously future Elidibus could help out with any timey-wimey magicks... We've had Warriors of Darkness already, time for the Scions of the Seventh Dusk? This head cannon also involves something happening to future Alisaie, hence her remaining unaffected... Certainly giving future Alphinaud cause to say screw it and mess with time/history... There's also something wonderfully enjoyable about a Sharlayan not just involving himself in history, but going a step further and straight up opting to alter it...

And yes, the Scions from the darkest most terrible timeline all have felt goatees...

EDIT: Oh, and I completely forgot, Alphinaud grandfather did kind of send some of use outside time to avoid the last Calamity... So he has a family history of pulling some timey-wimey stunts...

Actually thinking on that a bit... Papalymo copied Louisoix by sealing Shinryu, next up some Scion has to copy him with some time magic? 6.0 some Scion is going to become a Primal. Can't tell if that would be an interesting narrative to tread, or a predictable one...

[Iscah]

I also believe that the fellows who are now taking a long nap were brought to the WoD's world, in a manner very much alike the one the WoD troupe was brought here - soul only. It's quite possible that while they were in Hydaelyn, their physical bodies over at their world were in a similar comatose state.

Unfortunately, no. The grim truth is that, to quote the lorebook, "with Elidibus's guidance and knowledge, they ended their lives, and transcended the dimension to be born again as the Warriors of Darkness".

They say that in the game as well, though I can't get the transcript for that scene. But afterwards....

MSQ 3.4 "An Ending to Mark a New Beginning"

ALPHINAUD
I cannot help but wonder what awaits those wayward souls. If they gave their lives in order to travel to the Source, then in returning to the First, would they not...?
...But mayhap that was their wish.

Whether it was truly the only way to move across dimensions, or just Elidibus's oh-so-helpful recommendation on how they should go about it, their situation was entirely different to what's happened to the Scions. Additionally it sounds unlikely that the Warriors still exist, unless they've somehow remained as interdimensional ghosts.



Side note: checking quest scripts on Garland Tools, I noticed that Elidibus's dialogue tag is not simply his name but "ELIDIBUSEORZEA". What could that mean for future developments...?

[Anonymoose]

Side note: checking quest scripts on Garland Tools, I noticed that Elidibus's dialogue tag is not simply his name but "ELIDIBUSEORZEA". What could that mean for future developments...?

ELIDIBUS (SPEAKING THE EORZEAN TONGUE).

Ascian dialogue is marked not only with their name, but the language they're speaking. (EORZEA or ANCIENT)

This helps them keep straight when to use the red-on-black text.

[Iscah]

ELIDIBUS (SPEAKING THE EORZEAN TONGUE).

Ascian dialogue is marked not only with their name, but the language they're speaking. (EORZEA or ANCIENT)

This helps them keep straight when to use the red-on-black text.

Ohhhh~

I noticed they were speaking in red-on-black when it happened, but kind of forgot about it afterwards. (I didn’t think of it when they were back to normal text, anyway.)

I didn’t realise it was meant to be a different language, just that the Evil Shadow People get their own special evil shadow textboxes...