The Road to 5.0

[Anonymoose]

So this makes it seem that either she always need her own agend on each world/shard and can never truly interact with it [and we as the source might be different with that] or that she is just that weak so she needs one. I lean towards the first. But still hard how much I forgot after that time x))

I think She's always required the agents, as well. There are many tales of heroes that had eldritch powers, did everything they could, and it still didn't work out. I feel like She'd intervene more if She could. And I suspect that Hydaelyn has a good reason to be wary of making beings of great power, or giving mortals immortality, or what have you. I wouldn't be surprised if She once tried it and it went bad. (Inb4 that's how the Twelve started and it led to the First Umbral Era.) I theorize that She's content to sit it out until the Ascians rock the boat, and then fires some Echo buckshot into the crowd only because She has to - and the welcome package for that job is really, really lacking. Though, hell, even Midgardsormr finds it impossible to keep track of what people know, don't know, and need to be told.

Also, I guess being mad at the Mother for being vague, reactionary, cautious, and then escalating right to throwing nukes in an emergency is about equal to being mad at Her for having realistic imperfections, being goddess of Light and life only incidentally, and not preventing the game from a plot.

I wouldn't be terribly surprised if it turns out that both Zodiark and Hydaelyn need to be opposed for the sake of the planet's stability and the continued existence of mortals and free will. It's a common theme in many of the Final Fantasy games, after all. Including many of the 'side' titles. FFXIV has also proven very adept at making many antagonists and situations very nuanced and far from simple. This goes for both minor and major antagonists alike.

I doubt very much that the situation with Hydaelyn and Zodiark will be much different. Especially with how vague and evasive Hydaelyn can be combined with the dubious circumstances surrounding Minfilia's 'ascension'. I expect that we'll end up with a situation where Zodiark and Hydaelyn need to be merged anew to bring back true balance. Hydaelyn will want to be the dominant force. Zodiark will want to be the dominant force. Yet neither of them can be allowed to do that and must come to some sort of compromise.

It's odd that we agree so much on paragraph one and so little on paragraph two, lol.

Being that man (allegedly) came into being after the division, and has only lived, evolved, and thrived in this cosmos as it exists, I'm not sure we can "unring that bell" and survive with "the world we fought for" intact, if we survive at all. Elidibus would have us believe we'd be better for it, but I'm not so sure. I think Light and Dark must continue to exist, and I'm not sure that either can ever win. But is it too simple to assume that story arc ends with Zodiark existent but silenced and Hydaelyn willingly quiet from here on out as Her children thrive? What curveball is the game going to throw into that?

I have this nagging worry that if Hydaelyn is really the core of the planet, changing the core changes the planet.Can we say we won if we lose the world as we knew it? At least if She willingly goes quiet "in victory," the reins of history pass to man and we only have to kill the gods between.

But I completely disagree with you about Minfilia. She liked being one of Hydaelyn's chosen, she wanted to do her part to save the world, she labored to develop become stronger in the Echo and commune with Hydaelyn, and when Hydaelyn told her she was needed, she went willingly. Through her Hydaelyn spoke for a short while longer, history was nudged in a (hopefully) better direction, and Minfilia was happy for it. And when Hydaelyn had the power to release her essence as Emissary and send her to the First - even though Urianger basically orchestrated her exile from our world, she told everyone to forgive him because if he could have asked her, she would have volunteered. I think her consent makes a world of difference.

An alternative theory mistrusting of Hydaelyn should have persuasive answers for: Why, during the Astral Eras, when man was at their strongest, did she not reveal Herself and urge man to lay siege to every fragment of Dark in the known world? If mortals are Her children, couldn't She have made at least those entities without Darkness if She desired? Why is Darkness bound to the heart of man?

Granted, I think part of that answer is itself that Light cannot be Light without casting shadow in which the Dark can take root. Only in a world with neither Light nor Dark can we be free of that truth...and can mortals live in such a world? Should we want to?


Recently I've had this tingling beginning of a theory that mortal life IS Her defense, that we are Light and Darkness, that we keep the balance, that we live short, hard lives that inspire us towards cooperation and conflict - some act as if influenced by the Light, some act as if influenced by the Dark, but most of us just live, and there's nothing we won't do to keep living.

[ChaoticCrimson]

Hydaelyn has had "Ascians" of her own this entire time. Us. Only she seems to have a very different relationship to us then Zodiark does to the Ascians. And both Hydaelyn and Zodiark have Emissaries at this point too. Interestingly enough, Hydaelyn's has never claimed to have balance as her goal like Zodiark's has. Only, Hydaelyn's Emissary has acted much more obviously in accordance to what it is saying. Zodiark's Emissary's actions look more then a bit out of step with how it talks.

As far as I can tell, neither Hydaelyn or Zodiark can directly influence what happens on the Shards. Both of them need "avatars" to carry out their will. Zodark's avatars have been doing so continually for ages. Hydaelyn's only seem to pop up around the time of calamities.

In regards to this, and the topic of balance between Hydaelyn and Zodiark, it's also interesting to note how each one's avatars operate. While Hydaelyn's champions, the Warriors of Light, are more of an active force that surface in times of great need, able to take action and resolve the crises they've been called to deal with quickly and with relative ease, the Ascians on the other hand are typically a much more passive force, playing the long game and putting the pieces into place behind the scenes so that they can eventually line up in favor of Zodiark's resurrection.

[RukiaFae]

Just had a shower thought based off of the trailer. What if in the next expansion we go help prevent the calamity in Albert's world before dealing with Garlamald. We already know the developers can create a 1.0 simulated world from the rising event. So maybe are rewriting history by stopping the calamity on that shard. Plus if I remember correctly Yoshi stated back before 4.0 released we wouldn't be going straight to Garlamald in the next expansion. A recent interview on Reddit mentioned that he wanted to pay very close attention to the word calamity.

[KageTokage]

Just had a shower thought based off of the trailer. What if in the next expansion we go help prevent the calamity in Albert's world before dealing with Garlamald. We already know the developers can create a 1.0 simulated world from the rising event. So maybe are rewriting history by stopping the calamity on that shard. Plus if I remember correctly Yoshi stated back before 4.0 released we wouldn't be going straight to Garlamald in the next expansion. A recent interview on Reddit mentioned that he wanted to pay very close attention to the word calamity.

Honestly, the last thing I'd want from the next expansion is for it to be divided between two regions again.

Having a region as big and geographically diverse as Othard getting only a measly three zones to itself was kind of upsetting, and I feel they also had to rush the story as a side-effect of that.

If we really are going to travel to another shard, I'd rather it get a whole expansion to itself so we can see several different locations that have been altered from they were in the source.

[Alleo]

Honestly, the last thing I'd want from the next expansion is for it to be divided between two regions again.

Having a region as big and geographically diverse as Othard getting only a measly three zones to itself was kind of upsetting, and I feel they also had to rush the story as a side-effect of that.

If we really are going to travel to another shard, I'd rather it get a whole expansion to itself so we can see several different locations that have been altered from they were in the source.

Especially since the shattering of the world into these shards happened such a long time ago, do we even know if we have similiar worlds? (Would be kinda strange imo) So yes if we ever go to a shard, let it be a whole expansion. Otherwise some plot points will just be rushed through. Also I would love to travel through our world first before thinking about another shard.

[RukiaFae]

Yes I agree. I don't like the path Stormblood jumping between stories. It would be better if we stuck to one section for the expansion. I was just thinking about the title shadowbringers. What if we are bringing darkness to the lightfilled shard to prevent the calamity in that shard? All of the titles so far talked about actions they we had some hand in completing. Realm reborn, we helped rebuild after the calamity. Heavenwards we went towards the heavens to help Ishgard. Stormblood, we assisted in creating a revolution that brought a storm of blood.

[Alleo]

Well Yoshida did state that we would get more informations about the Ascians in the future so maybe they are the shadowbringers (since they are the ones that spread the darkness).

[Cilia]

Getting more information on the Ascians would be very welcome, because for as much as we know about their goals and methods, we don't really know much about them personally beyond a little information that can be gleaned from the Heavensward SMN questline.

The ultimate question I have surrounding them, and one that feels like it might be key in the upcoming story is who created them? The best conclusion I could come up with holding the information available is that they were created as Zodiark's dying curse toward Hydaelyn, but... if there are "original" and "transmigrated" Ascians... and, as I recall, there was an old legend about a Warrior of Light joining the Ascians... maybe... hmm...

[Anonymoose]

I recall, there was an old legend about a Warrior of Light joining the Ascians... maybe... hmm...

They say Ahldbhar was the mightiest of the twelve Archons. Rhalgr the Destroyer himself, taken form in Roegadyn flesh─a bloody mountain of a man, and a fearsome warrior, besides. Not unlike our friend at the Coliseum, eh?

You must've seen renderings of Rhalgr at some point─in paint or stone. Looks like a bag of angry muscles in a mage's robes, right? Aye, well, those are done in the likeness of Archon Ahldbhar.

Ahldbhar fought relentlessly against a clan of wicked sorcerers that sought only to wreak havoc on the world through their dark powers. But then, something happened... Something that threw Ahldbhar into deep despair. And in the end, he turned and took up with the enemy, though none can say as to why.

What came of him after his betrayal? Well, I confess I haven't heard the end of the tale myself. That bard's a wily bugger, see, and he only ever gets part way through before his throat dries out. Meaning I have to give him yet another bloody ale─free of charge, of course.

I always assumed it was 1.0 foreshadowing that someone who was emotionally weakened could turn up possessed by an Ascian (read: Thancred)

But SE has also been known to "reinterpret the knowns" from time to time.

[Ramesses]

I did always wonder about that Roegadyn in dark mage robes at that inn located in Fallguard Lake (the one on the upper level, always staring at the painting and muttering "Master...")

Ahldbhar?

I forget about him from time to time but just a few hours ago, I was reminded again of this chap while passing through there to kill Odin for laughs (Excalibur server).