Letter to MR Yoshi: Why parses system is destroying the ffxiv world.

[MoroMurasaki]

I find it funny that people seem to think if SE added an ingame parser or even just lifted the weird semi-ban on ACT that they would also be greenlighting harrassment.

Those are two different things. The only difference from the perspective of someone reporting harrassment is that they would actually have to be harrassed in order to complain. Right now if I get an incompetent player in PF I have to silently kick them or lie about 'reforming' where as with talk of parsers opened up I could say something like "Hey, you've got some clear holes in your rotation since you're sitting significantly below average despite your ilvl. Check out a guide and maybe hit the dummy for a bit, thanks for coming though."

Neither of those things is harrassment but right now one of them (the one that helps the underperformer less to boot) is okay while the other (more helpful) one would get me a visit from a GM.

[Lunafreya]

I find it funny that people seem to think if SE added an ingame parser or even just lifted the weird semi-ban on ACT that they would also be greenlighting harrassment.

Those are two different things. The only difference from the perspective of someone reporting harrassment is that they would actually have to be harrassed in order to complain. Right now if I get an incompetent player in PF I have to silently kick them or lie about 'reforming' where as with talk of parsers opened up I could say something like "Hey, you've got some clear holes in your rotation since you're sitting significantly below average despite your ilvl. Check out a guide and maybe hit the dummy for a bit, thanks for coming though."

Neither of those things is harrassment but right now one of them (the one that helps the underperformer less to boot) is okay while the other (more helpful) one would get me a visit from a GM.

Actually, letting parsing be a thing in the game would lead to too much harassment which is why it will never ever happen. Yoshi P was clear on this many times. Parsing by definition will make this game entirely worse of a community and while I dont oppose parsing like I said in my previous post, it would lead to very unpleasant PUGS. So, regardless of what is reported as harassment, if it has anything to do with parses it would be harassment.

[Shurrikhan]

Actually, letting parsing be a thing in the game would lead to too much harassment which is why it will never ever happen.

What proof, statistical or even syllogistic, do you have for that?

Parsing by definition will make this game entirely worse of a community and while I dont oppose parsing like I said in my previous post, it would lead to very unpleasant PUGS.

Parsing, by definition, is the deconstruction and summary of component elements, allowing more for intuitive and comprehensive understanding of what one has on hand or has observed. No part of that definition includes the worsening of communities. No part of any part of that definition even implies a risk of increased conflict (e.g. within a community). So just what basis are you following to arrive at that conclusion?

So, regardless of what is reported as harassment, if it has anything to do with parses it would be harassment.

You realize how nonsensical that is, right? By your definition, a player alleged to have a parser commenting on your glamour would be harassment, let alone someone offering helpful advice that you feel might have been more accurately tailored to your situation because s/he had a parser. "Guy continued the dungeon after I, the NIN, said 'brb'. May have had a parser. Please ban." Extreme examples or not, those are solidly within the extents of what you've proposed.

[Lunafreya]

What proof, statistical or even syllogistic, do you have for that?



Parsing, by definition, is the deconstruction and summary of component elements, allowing more for intuitive and comprehensive understanding of what one has on hand or has observed. No part of that definition includes the worsening of communities. No part of any part of that definition even implies a risk of increased conflict (e.g. within a community). So just what basis are you following to arrive at that conclusion?



You realize how nonsensical that is, right? By your definition, a player alleged to have a parser commenting on your glamour would be harassment, let alone someone offering helpful advice that you feel might have been more accurately tailored to your situation because s/he had a parser. "Guy continued the dungeon after I, the NIN, said 'brb'. May have had a parser. Please ban." Extreme examples or not, those are solidly within the extents of what you've proposed.

So you expect me to have screenshotted all of my parties where there was a parser involved leading to harassment? Sorry but nobody has time for that. However, if you use common sense with how easily people blow a fuse in this game you'd probably have to agree that parsing would just make everything worse in said parties. What if you went into savage and learning the fight and somebody had the gall to call out your numbers in a learning party? I dont think you understand what parsing can do to people.

I never said parsing by definition is harassment. I said anything with parsing will generally lead to harassment. There's a difference. Some people such as myself like parses to improve but others will think it is harassment because they are being put on the spot and it can be overwhelming to them. Before you get anything wrong i'd just like to say I dont MIND PARSING. However, if you're thinking parsing will not lead to more harassment then you're delusional as it would be used in pugs. Pugs generally blow up about any numbers called or mechanics not being done correctly after one wipe.

I'm not even going to comment on your last point though cause you're being silly.

[MoroMurasaki]

I never said parsing by definition is harassment. I said anything with parsing will generally lead to harassment.

If you can make huge, sweeping generalizations like this is it okay for me to go around the forums saying that people who are against parsers are all terrible at the game?

I mean, since we are working with mass generalization I guess I can base my (loud) opinions on a few negative experiences I've had with anti-parser people, right?

[Miste]

So you expect me to have screenshotted all of my parties where there was a parser involved leading to harassment? Sorry but nobody has time for that. However, if you use common sense with how easily people blow a fuse in this game you'd probably have to agree that parsing would just make everything worse in said parties. What if you went into savage and learning the fight and somebody had the gall to call out your numbers in a learning party? I dont think you understand what parsing can do to people.

I never said parsing by definition is harassment. I said anything with parsing will generally lead to harassment. There's a difference. Some people such as myself like parses to improve but others will think it is harassment because they are being put on the spot and it can be overwhelming to them. Before you get anything wrong i'd just like to say I dont MIND PARSING. However, if you're thinking parsing will not lead to more harassment then you're delusional as it would be used in pugs. Pugs generally blow up about any numbers called or mechanics not being done correctly after one wipe.

You have no facts to say any of this is a certainty.

You don't know if the harassment levels will change or not if there was a parser so....this stance is just an opinion so it is best not to word it as a fact or an absolute. It's not common sense if none of us knows the statistical frequency of harassment right now and then also the unknown of adding an official parser and seeing if the stats change.

I'd be fine with seeing the numbers in a learning party, it's a learning party after all. If I can see how I am doing I can take that information and think of what I can do to do better.

If someone sees their numbers and doesn't like what they see they have choices to deal with it: they can ignore it, or take the information and use it to do better next time.

It's delusional to think that you know for a fact that the harassment will get worse when you have no data to support that claim besides your own anecdotal experiences and biased opinions.

I do understand where you are coming from and I understand why people have reservations about parsers, but you can't say any of these things as facts.

[Lunafreya]

You have no facts to say any of this is a certainty.

You don't know if the harassment levels will change or not if there was a parser so....this stance is just an opinion so it is best not to word it as a fact or an absolute. It's not common sense if none of us knows the statistical frequency of harassment right now and then also the unknown of adding an official parser and seeing if the stats change.

I'd be fine with seeing the numbers in a learning party, it's a learning party after all. If I can see how I am doing I can take that information and think of what I can do to do better.

If someone sees their numbers and doesn't like what they see they have choices to deal with it: they can ignore it, or take the information and use it to do better next time.

It's delusional to think that you know for a fact that the harassment will get worse when you have no data to support that claim besides your own anecdotal experiences and biased opinions.

I do understand where you are coming from and I understand why people have reservations about parsers, but you can't say any of these things as facts.

If I am acting like it is a fact then I apologize but I'm just making a link between the many incidents I have seen in game and all of them involving parsing. As for the learning party I believe in the mechanics before dps mindset when I am learning a fight. Dupe jobs and low dps is acceptable there to me but if someone in the party tried to ruin the learning party by belittling people's numbers than maybe they shouldnt be in a learning party. It makes others feel overwhelmed and uncomfortable.

[Miste]

If I am acting like it is a fact then I apologize but I'm just making a link between the many incidents I have seen in game and all of them involving parsing. As for the learning party I believe in the mechanics before dps mindset when I am learning a fight. Dupe jobs and low dps is acceptable there to me but if someone in the party tried to ruin the learning party by belittling people's numbers than maybe they shouldnt be in a learning party. It makes others feel overwhelmed and uncomfortable.

It's fine, just saying things like "it's common sense" implies that if people don't agree with your opinion then they lack that generally good quality to have, which isn't really true...also calling people delusional if they don't agree with your opinion on this is a bit much. Still, no need to apologize, it's not a big deal or anything, I just figured you should maybe know how it comes across to others possibly.

Yeah, mechanics definitely come first I agree, but you didn't say that anyone was belittling with the numbers, you only said what I assumed meant "someone posted the numbers in chat in a learning party", numbers on their own isn't harassment or belittling...only if people take those numbers and be jerks to people with them which I understand it likely can happen, but I believe that people who will be jerks will be jerks even without a parser; they just find some other thing to be a jerk about like how many times you died, or made mechanic mistakes etc. So the frequency may or may not change, we don't know.

Anyone who claims parser numbers on their own is harassment well...that is untrue in my opinion. Numbers are just numbers. Facts have nothing to do with feelings nor are they inherently malicious. It is just information. What people do with that information can turn into harassment, or praise, or any number of things, but if no one says anything? It's just data.

[Ilan]

So you expect me to have screenshotted all of my parties where there was a parser involved leading to harassment? Sorry but nobody has time for that. However, if you use common sense with how easily people blow a fuse in this game you'd probably have to agree that parsing would just make everything worse in said parties. What if you went into savage and learning the fight and somebody had the gall to call out your numbers in a learning party? I dont think you understand what parsing can do to people.

I never said parsing by definition is harassment. I said anything with parsing will generally lead to harassment. There's a difference. Some people such as myself like parses to improve but others will think it is harassment because they are being put on the spot and it can be overwhelming to them. Before you get anything wrong i'd just like to say I dont MIND PARSING. However, if you're thinking parsing will not lead to more harassment then you're delusional as it would be used in pugs. Pugs generally blow up about any numbers called or mechanics not being done correctly after one wipe.

I'm not even going to comment on your last point though cause you're being silly.

Parsing will only lead to harrasment if the one who is parsing is a dick and guess what, he/she will always be a dick and will harass you anyway. Your point is yet another one of these examples of the anti parser faction which was proven wrong so many times because parsers are running in various games with way worse communities than FFXIV.

Is it harassment to tell someone that his/her dps is pretty low? No because it is a simple fact and most of the time you don't need a parser to see if someone plays like he/she is rolling the head over the keyboard. The only people who feel offended by this are the ones who feel offended by everything you write to them in terms of improving, even if its a simple tip.

[SargentToughie]

Yoshi P was clear on this many times.

No he wasn't.

To the best of my knowledge, actually, the most he's said on the matter was back in Heavensward when he basically said something along the lines of "Maybe we'll consider it when the disparity between a good/bad DPS player has equalized somewhat."