To Square Enix, these are the reasons why I am currently unsubbed from the FF14.

[KaldeaSahaline]

I can't agree with you here. I don't think it's fair to expect a side activity to be on par with the best kart racing series of all time, or the best kart racing game outside of that series. (Side note, I appreciate the CTR love! Great game.) What you're describing sounds pretty awesome, but it also sounds like a completely different game they should sell on its own. Particularly the level editor part.

For an MMO side activity, I expect something which is fun to do, doesn't demand constant attention, and can be played for a very long time. (Note that I wish MMO stuff wasn't all designed to last forever, because who has time for that? But it is what I've come to expect and it seems like everyone else wants it.) I think chocobo racing hits all of those notes.

Here we can agree to disagree. I see absolutely no reason that they can't do something like this. In fact, it's almost NEGLIGENT to design something in the same space, but NOT use the benchmark as inspiration.

I.e I would NEVER ever think to create a "party kart" game and not look at Mario Kart/CTR for some ideas of good/bad.

For me, side content needs to be fun enough to stand on its own, if it isn't it failed as "side content".

That's a fair analysis, but so what? If there's one thing I learned from Eureka, it's how much difference the downtime in a game like FFXI actually made to its enjoyment. FFXI was extremely obtuse and anti-player, yet people still loved it, and Eureka taps into a lot of the reason why that was the case. Why is that a bad thing? If it's designed to be fun, and it is fun, doesn't that make it well-designed?

The Magia board is a bit extraneous, but I don't know what design for that sort of thing would have actually worked well. The only thing I can think of would be to more heavily restrict how often you can change it, and I think that would have just made people mad. It doesn't really add anything to the content (except justifying a few quests), but I don't think it detracts either.

The magia board detracts because of opportunity cost (much like most other content forms I discussed above). The fact that something SIGNIFICANTLY better COULD have existed is why it's awful. In my opinion, Eureka had a few opportunities to really push the envelope and they dropped the ball. It's literally nothing I (and a lot of others) wanted. I didn't want more FATEs. I didn't want mindless mob grinds. I didn't want an illusion of choice less pitiful than the old level up stats we used to have. I wanted weather to matter. Mob AI to react to weather and have interactions with elements. I can go into examples, but I've done that in other threads.

I even built my own concept of Eureka a while ago (long before it came out) and posted it on these forums. To me, it had a significantly more engaging core design, but like all development had some issues. Fortunately, I have the luxury of sharing the concept with players to get feedback rather than pushing it live and hoping its well tuned/received.

As far as fun goes, Eureka itself isn't fun (again IMO). Killing nameless/mindless mobs and spamming one move over and over isn't fun. It's only fun because of the social aspect, Eureka can't get credit for that. Maybe it isn't fair to be that way, but I just cannot justify it.

I'm sure it's coincidental that the four you skipped were the ones I unabashedly loved.

I honestly didn't read them. I'm sorry for that, I got busy at work. I will put some effort into it tomorrow though if i get time (busy day tomorrow sadly).

If the "exercise" was to justify content you don't like in terms you've defined, then I would say I "understood" it but made no attempt to actually do it, because that's silly. My point is just that content you find terrible is enjoyed by other people. This game is well-designed for me, perhaps it is not so well-designed for you. And perhaps if they changed the design to your tastes, people like me would like it less. Would that be better or worse? That's a complicated question and I have no idea. But it's not as simple as "this is not engaging, therefore it is bad" because both halves of that premise are in question.

I do appreciate your response as well though, because it's always good to see things from multiple perspectives. And your original question helped me appreciate the game more by thinking about it in the first place. And because now I want a chocobo-based Mario Kart clone really bad!

The exercise I was hoping for was a more structed approach to my criteria. I.e. going itno specific details/examples as to how something is fun, well designed, and scalable. While your response very briefly touched on "fun" (subjectively speaking of course), you ignored the other aspects.

[KisaiTenshi]

Here we can agree to disagree. I see absolutely no reason that they can't do something like this. In fact, it's almost NEGLIGENT to design something in the same space, but NOT use the benchmark as inspiration.

I.e I would NEVER ever think to create a "party kart" game and not look at Mario Kart/CTR for some ideas of good/bad.

Here's the thing though, SE could conceivably design a PvP Chocobo-racing like the Mario Cart PvP mode. Almost everything is there for it. We have PvP maps, we have Chocobos, we have debuff "items". All that is needed is a way to allow the players to target each other on a PvP map and not be knocked off their mount. Heck... go one further and allow other mounts to be used as well, give every (non-cash shop) land mount their own specs for racing/pvp.

[KaldeaSahaline]

Here's the thing though, SE could conceivably design a PvP Chocobo-racing like the Mario Cart PvP mode. Almost everything is there for it. We have PvP maps, we have Chocobos, we have debuff "items". All that is needed is a way to allow the players to target each other on a PvP map and not be knocked off their mount. Heck... go one further and allow other mounts to be used as well, give every (non-cash shop) land mount their own specs for racing/pvp.

Oh I know they COULD. That's why I'm so frustrated. I'd be open to exploring other mounts in there, but keep specs as a choice not tied to the mount IMO. This way you can pick the one you want (aesthetically) without being beholden to specific kart style.