Squadron limit break (Ungarmax) can be used in regular duties by any job

[ThirdChild_ZKI]

Glad to hear this was fixed. . .

. . .Now how about all those PvP botters openly botting, including some on livestreams, for 6 months now?

[Hezkezl]

Hello everyone!

Yoshida-san has commented on the Ungarmax bug and about the emergency maintenance.

Best,
Lakukisu

In regards to his first point, about "Whether or not the comment written on the external website reporting that "it was reported to the GM team four months ago" is true or not".. I can't say for sure, but I do know that it was posted on reddit. https://www.reddit.com/r/ffxiv/comme...rw&sh=821bf5e9... So even if it wasn't directly reported to the GMs 4 months ago, it was posted on a very popular fansite and wasn't really noticed until a few days ago when a repost brought it to more people's attention. (I do have a friend in Discord claiming that he tried to mention it to SE, through a Twitter DM, Facebook DM, and in-game, but never got a response..)


There's also a possibility that it may have had a bug submitted for it, but the people monitoring the bug report forum are such sticklers for using the template that they may have moved it to 'insufficient information' or 'not a bug' if the person didn't use your bug reporting template the right way. I've had a friend submit a few bugs in the past only for them to be dismissed within minutes. I come along a few minutes later and use the template correctly (even providing snarky comments about requested information that does not apply to the bug in question) and it gets accepted. Who knows what other bugs have been reported but dismissed because the person didn't use the template correctly? Here's my proof:

Original bug report from a friend of mine (Gahoo, who is the owner of Gamer Escape): http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...s-key-item-bug Note the forum it's in. "Insufficient Information".

Second one from him: http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...ation-text-bus. Also in the 'Insufficient Information' forum.

Here are my two reposts of his posts, but using your template (which does not have sufficient information in it regarding his issue).

Post 1: http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...ssing-its-Name

Post 2: http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...erroneous-text

Note that both of my posts made it into the 'Accepted' forum, before they were moved to the 'Fixed' and 'Planning to Address' forums. The biggest difference, is that I used your template. The same information is in all threads.

And don't even get me started on another bug report I ever made, about a level 10 alchemist levequest having the wrong level given to it. http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...-level-25-item This was fixed the following Tuesday, so somehow it still made it to the right people for them to verify it was a bug, but the person who moved that to the 'Not a Bug Report' forum needs to be re-trained or something.

How in the heck is asking what kind of ISP people have pertinent to a missing chunk of text from the game's files? Or text that is there that shouldn't be visible? You make no accounting for those types of bugs, and people who don't use the template because it doesn't apply have their threads instantly dismissed.

-------

If you search for Ungarmax on the forums, you'll find absolutly nothing more than two days old posts.
And on reddit, only one very small post of a twitch clip can be found. And that absolutly doesn't consitute a good bug report. At most, it's a "look at this person cheating". But nothing more.

I have no idea why people say that it was reported 4 months ago. The very first acceptable report was done yesterday. (At least in english, that is.)

If there's someone to blame, it's us, the community, for thinking that stuff get reported and fixed without us having to do anything.

The forums are not the only place to report things. There's in-game, and through Twitter DMs, neither of which we can search.

[KageTokage]

The GM team seems to be the only consistently competent part of customer service, honestly.

They really deserve more power then they have, IMO. Then maybe cheaters might actually get banned, because all they can do right now is relay reports to the mythical action team that's supposed to be getting rid of them.

[Tridus]

Do you really think it would be possible for someone to genuinely think that using a 50% half-a-minute (extended) DPS buff (which has to be separately set for use in that content) for the whole party would be anything but unintended and cheating?

Frankly? Yes. I'm a software developer and I deal with end users all the time. People tend to grossly overestimate how much the majority of the userbase of any piece of software actually understands it.

For this one, I don't think the entire party even needs to know about it to benefit from it. Not sure exactly how it was triggered, but it sounds like someone could do it for everyone. The other people wouldn't necessarily know anything except "someone did something and now I have bigger numbers."

There's no doubt some of them knew exactly what they were doing. There's also no doubt there's a bunch of others who had a friend tell them "hey, use this trick!" and had little to no understanding of what they were actually doing except that it worked. Banning the latter group is mostly just going to get you a revenue hit without doing anything about a "cheating is okay" mentality, because they never had the knowledge to understand that they were cheating in the first place.

SE's own statement on this makes it pretty clear that they don't see everyone who used it as actively trying to cheat.

I think that's pretty much as likely as players "accidentally" splitting into smaller parties and thinking "hey, they must have meant for it to be ok to do this and get more loot because we're so smart to figure this out!".

Apparently the Phantom Train trick is okay, so how do you tell what is okay and what isn't? Players aren't mind readers. There's always going to be people looking for the edge cases to see what works and what doesn't. Especially in a case where SE themselves say it was possible to trigger it unintendedly with a macro that was otherwise legitimate to use.

They banned 1000 players for Salvage dupes, half of them permanent, I have no idea if the number in this case would be more or less. But from my personal perspective, it would hurt the company's reputation more to encourage cheating by leaving it unpunished.

I'm glad for the Yoshi P comment and hope they'll continue to be open about how this will be handled, and try to send a message for the players that using exploits will not go unpunished.

The funny thing about banning cheaters is if the number gets too big, you can't ban them all, because it affects the bottom line too much. Put that on top of the statement saying they recognize that unintended triggering of this was possible, and I wouldn't get my hopes up for a mass ban wave if I were you.

[SannaR]

Yeah i took a look at the bug report template on here because I wanted to know if my controller is a just me thing or if something on their side is making it switch to number one any time i would do something every time i'd start a fight, but then saw the template and I said screw that idk most of that info. Or some of it doesn't apply or would become redundant. I'm glad this has finally been fixed though.

[Remus]

If you search for Ungarmax on the forums, you'll find absolutly nothing more than two days old posts.
And on reddit, only one very small post of a twitch clip can be found. And that absolutly doesn't consitute a good bug report. At most, it's a "look at this person cheating". But nothing more.

I have no idea why people say that it was reported 4 months ago. The very first acceptable report was done yesterday. (At least in english, that is.)

If there's someone to blame, it's us, the community, for thinking that stuff get reported and fixed without us having to do anything.

Didn't they say they removed it so people can't replicate the exploit? If they kept it up in the accepted bugs section more people would find out about it and try it before it got fixed so they threw it under the bus and most likely forgot about it.

[ExKage]

In regards to his first point, about "Whether or not the comment written on the external website reporting that "it was reported to the GM team four months ago" is true or not".. I can't say for sure, but I do know that it was posted on reddit. https://www.reddit.com/r/ffxiv/comme...rw&sh=821bf5e9... So even if it wasn't directly reported to the GMs 4 months ago, it was posted on a very popular fansite and wasn't really noticed until a few days ago when a repost brought it to more people's attention. (I do have a friend in Discord claiming that he tried to mention it to SE, through a Twitter DM, Facebook DM, and in-game, but never got a response..)

And that thread (currently) only has 15 upvotes and 21 comments which sounds to me like it wasn't widely reported. I never knew about this until it blew up early this week. If you're willing to try and tell it to SE through twitter DMs, Facebook DMs, and in-game GM reports, why not the forums? Or even take it to General Discussion like most tend to do or even ask? There's obviously been some screw ups in getting the information back to the dev team, someone or some persons are in some trouble.

Didn't they say they removed it so people would replicate the exploit? If they kept it up in the accepted bugs section more people would find out about it and try it before it got fixed so they threw it under the bus and most likely forgot about it.

They removed the report that was made this week. When I tried looking, I didn't see one made earlier.

[Remus]

And that thread (currently) only has 15 upvotes and 21 comments which sounds to me like it wasn't widely reported. I never knew about this until it blew up early this week. If you're willing to try and tell it to SE through twitter DMs, Facebook DMs, and in-game GM reports, why not the forums? Or even take it to General Discussion like most tend to do or even ask? There's obviously been some screw ups in getting the information back to the dev team, someone or some persons are in some trouble.

Maybe SE should start adopting what most devs do and look at both reddit and the OF? Go look at the GW2 reddit for example and see the amount of Dev response on there. Just because it's on reddit doesn't mean you should ignore it. If you full well know the platform people use to discuss the game (and yes they know about reddit because they named it during fanfest) don't ignore it. Not everyone uses the official forum but I can say the amount using the OF is equal in reddit. You don't even need an account to read reddit. Just go on there and browse what people are talking about. If you see someone mention a bug look into it. They even have a representative on Reddit named SE_Kahuna but they never speak there only on rare occasions. So clearly they do look at it. You should never ignore fansites especially when it comes to MMOs. The template they have for bug reports is the worse thing I have seen, I'm honestly not surprised people don't use it.

Most other MMOs I have played make you put your name in, what category and then you explain what the bug is and what details you can give. Very simple process without needing to get information some people won't even know.

[Rockette]

And that thread (currently) only has 15 upvotes and 21 comments which sounds to me like it wasn't widely reported. I never knew about this until it blew up early this week. If you're willing to try and tell it to SE through twitter DMs, Facebook DMs, and in-game GM reports, why not the forums? Or even take it to General Discussion like most tend to do or even ask? There's obviously been some screw ups in getting the information back to the dev team, someone or some persons are in some trouble.

Because a lot of people are banned from the official forums and have been for years. It's not just a meme, when the game started, people got permabanned left right and centre from here.

Outside of this website, the official forums themselves are seen as a hot mess of misinformation, crying about parsers and most recently been a topic of LULZ due to the "please get rid of enrage thread". It's very hard to take these forums seriously.

So the person in question has tried other means, for whatever reason, including in game as per the post. In-game reports especially you'd think they'd notice. But they didn't.

[Rinuko]

...and the whole thing definitely sounds like the official response when the ffxi salvage exploit was discovered.

I get the same vibe. And that investigation took months iirc and banned what 200+ accounts? I remember it was a big talking subject back in 2009 or something.