Dark Knight: 5 Reasonable Changes To Balance DPS

[Chrono_Rising]

Gathering classes are too OP.

[Tegernako]

I don't think I agree with this...kind of.


DRK needs more then just DPS increases, they need to change how the kit interacts with itself, and then add on a dps increase as an additional change. But the focus should be on reworking TBN and DA and other aspects like...lack of CD which I think are an issue even if some others do not.

Also making it do more dps then WAR...uh...eh...I mean it wouldn't be a bad thing but what would be the point of warrior then? By far the most complicated rotations and the hardest to play optimally gets out dps'd by a class with a rotation even more brain dead then PLD...? In a vacuum that doens't really make any sense as a way to save the job.

This is why I think it'd be better to focus on making the job itself feel/flow better and then adding additional dps (which can be done at the same time). If DRK did end up doing more damage then war but the job itself made more sense and flowed better then I don't think I'd have an issue with it. But just straight up increasing the dps to more then war. I don't think that's a good idea. I think you can make the job as a whole feel better and make it do more dps at the same time. Because I think that increased DPS is just a band-aid. (Though it does help a lot in fixing some issues, not trying to downplay it's uses)

And I don't feel that your changes do both those things. You need to make DRK stand out for more then just DPS. Needs to feel/flow better, be a better contributor to the team, have more sustain. Hope the post makes sense.

[Chrono_Rising]

I don't think I agree with this...kind of.


DRK needs more then just DPS increases, they need to change how the kit interacts with itself, and then add on a dps increase as an additional change. But the focus should be on reworking TBN and DA and other aspects like...lack of CD which I think are an issue even if some others do not.

Also making it do more dps then WAR...uh...eh...I mean it wouldn't be a bad thing but what would be the point of warrior then? By far the most complicated rotations and the hardest to play optimally gets out dps'd by a class with a rotation even more brain dead then PLD...? In a vacuum that doens't really make any sense as a way to save the job.

This is why I think it'd be better to focus on making the job itself feel/flow better and then adding additional dps (which can be done at the same time). If DRK did end up doing more damage then war but the job itself made more sense and flowed better then I don't think I'd have an issue with it. But just straight up increasing the dps to more then war. I don't think that's a good idea. I think you can make the job as a whole feel better and make it do more dps at the same time. Because I think that increased DPS is just a band-aid. (Though it does help a lot in fixing some issues, not trying to downplay it's uses)

And I don't feel that your changes do both those things. You need to make DRK stand out for more then just DPS. Needs to feel/flow better, be a better contributor to the team, have more sustain. Hope the post makes sense.

I'm actually more that ok with the way dark knight flows and plays. From optimizing dark arts use, to strategically breaking TBN to get off bloodspillers in trick attack windows. I think the reward for TBN could be better, and hope for that change, but I don't think that is ground breaking on its own. The problem with TBN is the risk reward factor, not necessarily the mitigation is provides. as far as adding new effects, I am extremely doubtful that will happen before 5.0 as we are fairly far into the expansion. The best I think we can hope for is number tweaking.

Warrior has enough toys to play with, being a flexible class with multiple cooldowns to rotate and even "no activation needed" shields to help the party. By the developers own logic, warrior now offers the intermediate party utility, it should do intermediate dps. It doesn't need dps to be run, people play it because its fun, flexible, and has raid shields available. Having a complicated rotation is not a reason to have the best dps (even if it feels like it should), it wasn't this way in HW and there is no need for it to be that way now.

[Kazzoey]

snip

I'm with you on that. It's kind of a hidden stereotype in online games that people just water everything down into making things do more DPS. It was the same thing with PLD in 3.0 as well: everyone just complaining about giving them more damage. Since DRK's release, I've been pretty disappointed for the play style. It's not that it isn't entertaining, it's that the job doesn't feel ANYTHING like a Dark Knight in any final fantasy game of mine. It feels more like a generic DPS class that has some passive siphon and mitigation. I would put far more value on a rework to showcase the Dark Knight's position in the Tank department. Paladin is off-healing and support, Warrior is heavy duty burst DPS/mitigation, and what is Dark Knight? .............. consistent? As you said, increasing DPS to put it on par with or surpassing warrior makes no sense. They need to reinforce a more specific position/niche that revolves around the job instead of playing the "I have more DPS" game. Machinist used to have this problem as well back in 3.0 but now they've found the design and it works well. Of the 3.0 jobs, Dark Knight is now the odd one out as the aimless "What is the point of this job again?" job.

[Chrono_Rising]

I'm with you on that. It's kind of a hidden stereotype in online games that people just water everything down into making things do more DPS. It was the same thing with PLD in 3.0 as well: everyone just complaining about giving them more damage. Since DRK's release, I've been pretty disappointed for the play style. It's not that it isn't entertaining, it's that the job doesn't feel ANYTHING like a Dark Knight in any final fantasy game of mine. It feels more like a generic DPS class that has some passive siphon and mitigation. I would put far more value on a rework to showcase the Dark Knight's position in the Tank department. Paladin is off-healing and support, Warrior is heavy duty burst DPS/mitigation, and what is Dark Knight? .............. consistent? As you said, increasing DPS to put it on par with or surpassing warrior makes no sense. They need to reinforce a more specific position/niche that revolves around the job instead of playing the "I have more DPS" game. Machinist used to have this problem as well back in 3.0 but now they've found the design and it works well. Of the 3.0 jobs, Dark Knight is now the odd one out as the aimless "What is the point of this job again?" job.

While I don't disagree that dark night needs more lore driven tools, I think that waiting for those just means dark knight will be a forgotten tank until 5.0. The job needs help, and if we cannot expect such tools outisde of an expansion then we need something to offer.

I also think your view of paladin in 3.0 is missing some key details. Paladin's felt crippled in dps, thats for certain being 20% behind for most of the expac will do that. However, their utitlity and defense were also issues. Not being able to block magic and having a strength reducing effect meant half of their kit went out the window in magical tiers. No blocking meant no sheltron, no bulwark, no passive blocks, and cover only moved physical damage from one target to another. That is what made Paladin bad in 3.x. Paladin did have divine veil, but comparing that to reprisal + delirium + the warrior effect and you can see the issue of uptime.

That said, DPS is seen as the most valuable resource. If dark knight is going to not offer a way to deal with raid damage (either by lowering it directly, shielding it, or give a way to help heal up), offer little relevant utility, and have less self sustain than other tanks, then yes I think the only reasonable position to increase is damage.