Would this help balance the Tanks out?

[aodhan_ofinnegain]

PLD/WAR are in a good spot, tbh nerfing is not the answer to this, the fact DRK was gutted moving into 4.x but nothing was given in return to really address the loss is the issue. Making huge changes to the job is not a solution neither but can't really see a third combo giving a constant dmg increase or decrease buff/ debuff as most have been scrapped or reworked with limitations bar slashing/piercing/blunt dmg debuff. Also DoT like scourge as a possible third combo is possible but moves towards the realm of making jobs a degree generic which also needs to be avoided. Main changes are reducing high mp costs to a degree and some slight potency increases, maybe give some sort of unique raid utility and some third combo so it doesn't feel like a 1 2 3 job with oGCDs inbetween. As for one big potency skill on PLD, think after going so long without one we deserve one.

[Reinhardt_Azureheim]

PLD main here, wouldn't give two f**ks about losing a bit of damage if at least Dark Knight got something like oGCD Grit and a 10-15% damage boost within blood weapon and / or 80s Delirium.

Dark Dance has no real place if you ask me, they might as well make Dark Mind omni-damage based or bring back Shadow Skin. There is no reason for massive parry play without a skill that goes off after a parry similar to PLDs shield swipe after blocking.

[Marxam]

2) WAR is being over-rewarded, as per usual, by having both the highest burst damage and the highest total DPS.

That's debatable. While war burst is good its the overall raiddps that counts. As a WAR main, the change to SiO is good however we still have to juggle Infuriate timers and match them perfectly with Berserk and Inner Release to even get a chance at matching or even exceeding pld. PLD just needs to keep goring up and use its off gcds when available and its gg. If there is one thing I would change about DRK is to make TBN six seconds instead of five. I find this to a reasonable change. Other than that SE doesn't see anything wrong with DRK. I mean world first UBcoB had a drk in it.

[Chrono_Rising]

That's debatable. While war burst is good its the overall raiddps that counts. As a WAR main, the change to SiO is good however we still have to juggle Infuriate timers and match them perfectly with Berserk and Inner Release to even get a chance at matching or even exceeding pld. PLD just needs to keep goring up and use its off gcds when available and its gg. If there is one thing I would change about DRK is to make TBN six seconds instead of five. I find this to a reasonable change. Other than that SE doesn't see anything wrong with DRK. I mean world first UBcoB had a drk in it.

The world first may have had a dark in it, but only about 3 confirmed dark knights have cleared compared to 22 Warriors and 25 paladins. World first doesn't mean much as a metric, and most groups seem to be choosing warrior paladin to run and clear. This doesn't seem to strictly be a theoretical argument, strategically people are bringing in a certain composition, and it doesn't appear that most groups are choosing dark knight as part of that strategy. Not shockingly, there doesn't appear to be many of places where a 5.5k shield on one person would save the raid.

I cannot stress this enough, it is too small a sample to draw any conclusions from, but right now dark knight is behind in the numbers game by 20% dps in ultimate. This could be because of playing cautiously paired with an extremely small sample set, but many have pointed out harder content could force more tank stance on dark because its kit is weaker than the other tanks. If that holds up, again really too small a sample to generalize from, that is a way more important metric than which tank was brought in first.

[Capn_Goggles]

If you want the tanks "balanced" then DRK and WAR need to bring more DPS to the table. Of course, this still leaves the issue of their actual kit design. Even outside of the numbers, WAR's kit got hurt pretty badly by silly design choices, and DRK got the equivalent of a cactus slathered in hot sauce jammed you-know-where. I'd be fine where they are numbers and utility-wise right now if they were any fun to actually play.

Warrior, at the very least, needs to come off the "Fell Cleave plus Fell Cleave Accessories" train it's on right now. Landing a triple fell cleave felt decently satisfying, but the design team pulled a fat kid and slammed their face into the cake because the slice they got was tasty. Warrior's damage is so dependent on fell cleave that RNG becomes a much more powerful influence on DPS numbers than should be expected. DRK I don't need to go terribly in-depth on because people much more familiar with the job than myself have already made their wishlist.

[Rubytoe]

PLD main here, wouldn't give two f**ks about losing a bit of damage if at least Dark Knight got something like oGCD Grit and a 10-15% damage boost within blood weapon and / or 80s Delirium.

Dark Dance has no real place if you ask me, they might as well make Dark Mind omni-damage based or bring back Shadow Skin. There is no reason for massive parry play without a skill that goes off after a parry similar to PLDs shield swipe after blocking.

I vote this.

[Crater]

That's debatable. While war burst is good its the overall raiddps that counts.

No. Burst is utility; it has value beyond just contributing to overall DPS, and class balance should reflect that. The class that deals the highest burst damage should never be the class that also deals the highest overall DPS, and this game is going to have severe balance issues until SE realizes that and starts changing class design accordingly. Both Paladin and Dark Knight should be dealing higher overall DPS than Warrior, to balance out the fact that Berserk + Fell Cleave is always going to result in Warrior dealing 30-40%+ more damage during a burst window.

[FallenWings]

No. Burst is utility; it has value beyond just contributing to overall DPS, and class balance should reflect that. The class that deals the highest burst damage should never be the class that also deals the highest overall DPS, and this game is going to have severe balance issues until SE realizes that and starts changing class design accordingly. Both Paladin and Dark Knight should be dealing higher overall DPS than Warrior, to balance out the fact that Berserk + Fell Cleave is always going to result in Warrior dealing 30-40%+ more damage during a burst window.

Burst type damage is always going to be king over stable. But other than phase pushing(which the DPS classes have more influence in than WARs slight edge over the other tanks has), 'balanced' content design is never going to make a burst phase where only WAR can handle it versus a PLD or DRK, both of which are also capable of 'bursting' but agreeably not to the degree of a Berserk/IR window. It's a flavour of damage type for the most part and is of little consequence because its not that big of a gap between the other tanks.

WAR just needs to not have all its eggs in Inner Release. 2 minutes of pool noodle damage for 20 seconds of chainsaw damage is not all that fun.

[Eyvhokan]

WAR just needs to not have all its eggs in Inner Release. 2 minutes of pool noodle damage for 20 seconds of chainsaw damage is not all that fun.

Inner release was a mistake?

[Jukebox12]

Well isn't Dark Knight suppose to do more dps than paladin? I mean paladin has waaay more mitigation and party helping tools than dark, along with a long range spell that does 400 potency, to keep uptime when forced to be at a distance. I thought the direction square was currently going for was "Damage: WAR>DRK>PLD" then "Mitigation and Party Utility: PLD>DRK>WAR. Making Drk a mixture of both.

Dark knight should never be a mixture of both. and that 400 poteny holy spirit is only good for every 60 secs and which you can get 5 which is 2000 every 60 secs unless you got a Bard that does Refesh at that moment. Most of our damage comes from our Flight or fight Combos.. and right now the damage should be Dark>war>pld and mitigation and party utility should be Pld>war>Dark.. right now dark knight needs a major buff to its damage to make it viable due to its low utility. Please do not talk about tanks if you do not know anything