Is EX/Savage content a battle or a dance number?

[Hruodig]

I will say that the idea that having difficulty memorizing large numbers of patterns reflects in any way on one's skill as a healer is ludicrous, though. Learning dance steps has nothing to do with healing.

I was curious if anyone felt the same as I did. I had no intent or desire to ruffle feathers, yet despite my best efforts seem to have done so.

I never saw it as an attack, I just don't really think it's accurate to say that your inability to memorize mechanics has no bearing on your ability as a healer in this game. The ability to plan for mechanics and events that happen in a fight have everything to do with healing in ff xiv.

[Miste]

It's just not my jam, and that's alright. It's no reflection on my healing skills, it a reflection on my terrible memorization skills. I've cleared O1S nine times and O2S five. And...I have no motivation for more. It's simply not fun to me. I feel like I'm spending more time playing DDR then I am playing healer.

Well there would be the main issue.

In savage it isn't all about healing skills only. When it comes to savage content it is about healing when necessary while contributing as much DPS as you can as well all while managing all the mechanics and while doing your best to minimize negative impact from other party members mistakes. All of these aspects combine together into what makes a good savage healer in this game.

This requires you to learn the fight more than just the outwardly obvious mechanics but also learn HP thresholds and when tanks take more damage (for example Alte Roite has a pretty hard hitting tank smack with his tail that has no cast bar, you simply have to learn when it happens).

Also trying the content when it is 3-4 months old isn't a good experience of difficulty when it comes to healing. You are likely close to item level 340 which will trivialize the healing requirements in O1S and O2S because you are way above the minimum item level. Personally I cleared O1S and O2S around i310, O2S for example was quite strict at such low item levels... basically if you had no shields or mitigation for Gravitational Wave it can one shot people because their gear is simply too low even at full HP to take the hit.

In general if you cannot remember fights well it will impact your healing skills so unfortunately it does have a reflection on them and your ability as a healer; that is just how this game works. If it is simply not fun for you then it just isn't, it may benefit you to maybe try a different role instead of healer if healer doesn't seem fun for you in savage.

[Aylis]

The term you are looking for is "Synchronized rope jumping" , I believe.

I just call it "The Square Dance"

[Xerek]

If my problem is the large number of mechanics turning fights into choreographed dances, how would switching roles help? My issue is with the large number of mechanics and the high price of failing them, not what I do in the small windows I'm not doing mechanics. I'd rather fight a battle then do the hokey-pokey. But...it's becoming painfully clear that I didn't explain myself well enough, and most people don't realize what and why I find Savage disappointing, with many responses boiling down to "get gud".

[KaivaC]

If my problem is the large number of mechanics turning fights into choreographed dances, how would switching roles help? My issue is with the large number of mechanics and the high price of failing them, not what I do in the small windows I'm not doing mechanics. I'd rather fight a battle then do the hokey-pokey. But...it's becoming painfully clear that I didn't explain myself well enough, and most people don't realize what and why I find Savage disappointing, with many responses boiling down to "get gud".

I thought you were pretty clear, and from the responses you've received thus far, seems like everyone else here clearly understands what you're saying as well. It's just that some parts of what you said may not sound right. No need to be super defensive - this is an open discussion, so naturally, differing opinions are bound to spring up.

[Xerek]

I'm likely close to my post limit for the day, so I think this will be the last for the night. As such, let me be careful, and try to clarify what I meant.

I am disappointed that EX/Savage is so heavily dependent on mechanics, and that the punishment for failing those mechanics are so brutal. To me, it feels less like a fight, and more like a dance routine. This is my opinion. I find it interesting that some people have suggested that these battles have reached their apex of difficulty, and that there is no way to make the fights more challenging, except for these additional mechanics. That the fights themselves cannot be tuned to be any more difficult. That was something I was actually curious to explore. I am not trivializing the mechanics. I am full aware of the challenge they add to an encounter, and no, they are not easy. Their role is to make the fights more difficult and they do just that. My point is, I think they change the flow of the fight, with 99% of deaths/wipes coming not from the direct combat, but instead from failing mechanics. And that simply wasn't something I was hoping for out of EX/Savage content. Again, this is a playstyle preference. This is not to disparage Savage veterans, or people that like the status quo.

I hold to my salad example. I don't mind two tablespoons of dressing on my salad to add flavor. I don't want half a bottle dumped on, though. For others, I can understand if they find their salad tasteless and welcome the half-bottle, it's just not my taste.

It's not about what makes a good Savage healer. If I don't like the ride, getting better at it isn't going to change my opinion. My view is not born out of frustration. I've gotten my O1S and O2S clears, and while I've read guides and watched videos, I've not even attempted O3S. It isn't about failing, and raging against a system. It's more finding learning and performing the dance to be utterly boring and simply not fun. It's the same reason I don't do well with DPS classes, I find rotations mind-numbing. But that's me. That's my mindset. I do better adapting, working on the fly. It's why I've tried RDM and MCH, because there is still a random element to conform to, and why I failed at 3.x DRG, because the 20+ long rotation was poison to me. I am not saying there is anything wrong with Savage the way it is. It's me saying I like vanilla, and maybe vanilla with chocolate swirl, but not double chocolate ice cream...and wondering how many people actually do enjoy it, and how many people think that's just too much chocolate on their cone. Responses such as "Keep eating and you'll learn to love double chocolate." don't help.

I...hope that clears things up, at least a bit. If not, I doubt there is really anything else I can say on the matter.

[Miste]

If my problem is the large number of mechanics turning fights into choreographed dances, how would switching roles help?

Because it is something to consider if you haven't tried it already?

I'd rather fight a battle then do the hokey-pokey. But...it's becoming painfully clear that I didn't explain myself well enough, and most people don't realize what and why I find Savage disappointing, with many responses boiling down to "get gud".

Just because some reply with suggestions that may not end up helping your situation doesn't mean they don't understand what your issue is. I would still suggest a role switch no matter what because you may find a job you like a lot in doing so which may make you enjoy savage on it. If you haven't tried then how would you know?

If you didn't want people's opinions or suggestions then why post?

[Enjuden]

With the current system we have, I don't see how it's possible to change it. SE has an idea for how their game will go regardless, but figuring out what will happen beforehand has been a part of raiding in every mmo that I've played, including XIV. Bluntly, the dance thing has been part of mmo raiding for decades. Always has and always will be a part of these games, at least in my mind. I'm not the best at memorization either, but it's something you just grind out. Same thing as playing optimally really. Failing in combat means you simply do not have the ilvl for it, or your dps don't know how to dps and shouldn't be raiding in the first place. With how XIV is, combat being the key to making a fight more difficult is impossible. It's not an action mmo, or a Souls series. It's standard mmo fare.

Personally, if I wanted the fights to be different, I'd just play fighting games against other people. Or Monster Hunter.

[Selova]

Welcome to every end-game fight in MMO history? All end-game raid fights on it's hardest difficulty are all like this, I'm not sure why this is surprising you now, this is how it's always has been. Just so we're on the right page, those fights (Savage/EX/Ultimate) are not just about "who can flawlessly perform this "dance routine", even if all 8 people in your raid did all the mechanics perfectly, if they can't play their class at the highest level that is required of them while doing this "Dance routine" You will eventually wipe to enrage. So all in all, It's not about if your entire raid can successfully do all the mechanics/Dance steps, It's "Can my entire raid team perform at the highest level possible WHILE executing the mechanics perfectly. That is what makes all these fights challenging.

[Xerek]

Because it is something to consider if you haven't tried it already?



Just because some reply with suggestions that may not end up helping your situation doesn't mean they don't understand what your issue is. I would still suggest a role switch no matter what because you may find a job you like a lot in doing so which may make you enjoy savage on it. If you haven't tried then how would you know?

If you didn't want people's opinions or suggestions then why post?

I welcome opinions, it's the aggressive backlash of some I find disappointing. And again, if my problem is with the mechanics dance, how would a role-change help? I'm still doing all the same mechanics regardless of role. The small bit of time I get to perform my class actions, I'm perfectly happy with. It's what I feel there should be far more of. If I played tank or DPS, I would still hate the mechanics dance every bit as much. That's why I get the feeling you don't understand the nature of my disappointment. I find it disappointing that the mechanics all but overshadow the class play. Changing roles won't change that. But that's just the way Savage tier is built. Heavy, punishing mechanics, and small windows to do your things. So you need to memorize the fight and plan out a step-by-step plan of attack to survive mechanics and squeeze out as much tank/heal/DPS as you can.

In other words, I think mechanics play far too much of a part in Savage. What role I am won't change that. But that's just the way it is. Most people are fine with it, and some even assert that it has to be that way, that there is no other way to make Savage challenging enough. I don't find that fun, but again, that's just how I feel about it. And it just means EX/Savage isn't for me, that's all.