On the Nature of Monk

[SpeckledBurd]

I just have to say. I have been leveling Dragoon and Samurai. Haven't touched Ninja yet but it really feels like they bolted on abilities on top of Monk whereas with Samurai and Dragoon they are a true expansion. You could theoretically take away everything Monk was given in SB and no one would complain as the abilities break it more than it helps.

Interestingly, if you look at a lot of the feedback Monk had from Heavensward, people largely thought that Monk was a very complete, smooth playing Job. It's just that Stormblood's action rework and its new actions broke that smooth feeling with the removal of Touch of Death and the addition of Riddle of Fire.

Honestly if I could go back to Heavensward Monk in terms of its overall kit, I happily would, and I don't think that speaks to Monk this expansion.

[KanameYuuki]

It's a shame my JP isn't good enough yet to understand that part of the forum, anyone here could give me a quick summary from their point of view? same on French and German.

[Tigerlilley]

I'm sad you guys. I was one of Monks biggest voices in these threads and now....well... I finally got broken. Have had to switch to Ninja for Ultimate. Trick attack, not losing stacks at every intermission / jump because adlo shields are too good...all these things add up. I've been main monk since T1 was a thing

Keep up the good fight.

[Aomine1992]

Throw the whole class away lol jk but seriously I don't play Monk but I notice how shitty they get treated....drgs complained a hell of alot and got an complete overhaul to maintaining BOTD and geriskogul which was our version of tornado kick (not as harsh)...SMNs complained got a skill back and some nice changes...

Monks have been complaining since 3.0 came out and it's crickets...all these fights are terrible for MNK all these bosses either turn to much or jump for too long...and the long list of useless skills that made it to 4.0 is ridiculous and let's not forget Monk feels the same after lvl 50 barely anything changes besides the chakra gauge all the way up to 70

Devs it's time to shift gears from SMN because we all know you guys still Can't figure out the pet AI and move on to addressing MNKs issues since before 3.0

[Silver-Strider]

snip

MNKs have been complaining for far longer than 3.0 but your heart's in the right place.
If we're being perfectly honest, the only complaint MNK's have ever really gotten an answer to was our sustain but that came as a sweeping change for all melee, not just MNK.

We still have Aggro issues. We have arguably the most amount of useless (or at least highly situational skills) out of all the classes. We have the worst maintenance skills for our chief mechanic out of all the classes. We get punished the most severely for missing our positionals. We're no longer the highest personal DPS in the game. Our raid utility is outclassed by nearly every other utility. We didn't gain any additional attacks this expansion, just multiple layers of RNG that is somehow keeping our damage numbers high while simultaneously kneecapping our total damage output.

So, what does MNK have exactly that makes ANY of this warranted?

[BucklesTrespen]

I read the JP Monk thread (Google translated but you get the gist) and the JP player base is mostly echoing what we're upset with here; the slow on Riddle of Fire, knowing Yoshi was originally going to give us GL IV but then opted for a skill that slows us down instead, how Riddle of Earth doesn't work half the time due to long phases, dodging the damage, shields negating the damage etc.

Honestly, I don't know why they didn't give us a new attack like every other class. You could literally spitball ideas all day long (as many people have done across the many Monk threads) and most would look better than any of the buffs and passives we got this expansion.

For instance-- give monks a 4th step in the rotation (and remove the Fist Stances - converting them into the following...)

Demolish, Snap Punch and Rockbreaker now change form to Chi Form:

Fists of Fire - requires Chi form.
Delivers an attack with a potency of 210 (no directional bonuses).
Additional Effect: The next weaponskill to critically hit grants 1 chakra. (note: remove deep meditation as a trait)
Changes form to Opo-Opo.

Fists of Lightning - requires Chi form.
Delivers an attack with a potency of 120 (no directional bonuses)
Additional Effect: Grants a stack of Greased Lightning.
Changes form to Opo-Opo.

Fists of Earth - requires Chi form.
Delivers an attack with a potency of 150 to all nearby enemies.
Changes form to Opo-Opo.

[Silver-Strider]

For instance-- give monks a 4th step in the rotation (and remove the Fist Stances - converting them into the following...)
Demolish, Snap Punch and Rockbreaker now change form to Chi Form:

Fists of Fire - requires Chi form.
Delivers an attack with a potency of 210 (no directional bonuses).
Additional Effect: The next weaponskill to critically hit grants 1 chakra. (note: remove deep meditation as a trait)
Changes form to Opo-Opo.

Fists of Lightning - requires Chi form.
Delivers an attack with a potency of 120 (no directional bonuses)
Additional Effect: Grants a stack of Greased Lightning.
Changes form to Opo-Opo.

Fists of Earth - requires Chi form.
Delivers an attack with a potency of 150 to all nearby enemies.
Changes form to Opo-Opo.

An interesting concept but needs some work. By introducing a 4th GCD into MNK's Rotation, you throw off the timers for DK, TS and Demo entirely and while you can reconcile that with improving the timers on those buffs, it also means a larger rotation to refresh GL and more of a chance of it dropping in Phase shifts since we can't refresh it as swiftly.

Lightning is also in a very odd since it would only serve as a means to build up GL after it's fallen off and PB is on CD, which is something MNK players want to stop from happening entirely, if possible. It might make Tornado Kick somewhat more usable but probably not enough to be viable, especially since using Lightning is already a HUGE DPS loss from using Fire and getting that guaranteed Chakra.

[Zafire063]

Just be happy you're not Ninja's. The only movement we have is Shukichi, and it's a short-range transport that requires you to target where you want to move to. I would much prefer shoulder tackle.

[Powercow]

Just be happy you're not Ninja's. The only movement we have is Shukichi, and it's a short-range transport that requires you to target where you want to move to. I would much prefer shoulder tackle.

Shukuchi, *especially* post-buff, is possibly the best movement skill in the entire game aside from maybe Sprint.

Also, imagine if Shukuchi was part of your rotation so it's never up when you actually need it for movement.

[Zafire063]

Shukuchi, *especially* post-buff, is possibly the best movement skill in the entire game aside from maybe Sprint.

Also, imagine if Shukuchi was part of your rotation so it's never up when you actually need it for movement.

I must be doing it wrong then, I have an extremely hard time aiming while moving to get back into range. The aiming cursor moves as you do, and the range isn't very big. The only time I find myself using it is if I'm standing still waiting for an AoE to end. Wish I could just make it launch me forward.