AST Sects: Should it go both ways?

[Jukebox12]

Actually just counting embrace she is actually roughly 5-6% of our healing.

Not to mention whispering done is the strongest HoTs

[miraidensetsu]

this is exactly why i gave up ast for this expansion....the sects were perfect before they changed it. now there's no real reason to use diurnal unless you just feel like it.

Or you are co-healing with a SCH. D.AST have regens that don't overwrite the SCH's barriers. Or if you are with another AST and he's Noct.

In those cases, Diurnal is better for the party.

[bugmancer]

i agree that sch and whm are better at their respective abilities and now the sects just feel like a cheap imitation. whm ast was a solid combo in end game content of hw and now i think it's leaning more whm sch. sch got so many quality of life changes that ast doesn't compare to either healers as it sits now... i am mearly complaining at the lack of versatility. i main all heals and i'm used to picking and chosing based on which is stronger in the situation. stormblood additions to ast are just incredibly underwhelmimg

[bugmancer]

and to clarify my original reply was speaking in terms of healing in 4 man content. the regen counter on diurnal is just too short and the lack of spell speed makes dpsing feel hardly worth the effort. just a personal impression

[Maku]

Scholar offers more party utility

????? How????

AST card system is literally more utility than both other healers put together. The Card system also IS part of our DPS. Raising the DPS or the entire team with balance, arrow, and spear is the reason out personal DPS skills are weaker. If we had the same power in our spells we would be obliterating the other two healers. You absolutely must take into account the card system when talking about AST DPS.

[Kabzy]

whm ast was a solid combo in end game content of hw and now i think it's leaning more whm sch.... stormblood additions to ast are just incredibly underwhelmimg

No, it really wasn't. It was viable, but as of 3.3 and more so 3.4, AST/SCH was the best by far. WHM is great now, and their healing kit is a lot easier to use compared to AST, hence why we're seeing them in Ultimate groups. However once everyone knows the fight, and understands ES timings and so on, AST/SCH is still technically the better comp for pushing the most DPS, providing you don't need the amount of healing output WHM can bring.

As for your second point, I think it's all subjective. Personally I think on release WHM got the most love, AST got the AoE they needed, and SCH got gutted the most. The most recent changes have balanced everything out quite nicely, SCH might have an edge over N.AST now, but it isn't as bad as 4.0 where N.AST literally did everything better. Each healing comp is good, not just viable.

AST card system is literally more utility than both other healers put together.

It's mainly to do with the RNG of the cards. AST has the potential to buff more significantly, but pairing Selene's Fey Wind with Chain Strategem and SCHs own better DPS, supposedly the party utility is not that different. And with SCHs tools not being gated by RNG, some would prefer it. There's a post about it on Reddit somewhere if you go and search, they go into a lot more detail and calcs etc.

[bugmancer]

i don't disagree with any of your points since you provide convincing support but i think it's just a perception i have from the later patches of hw. i once cleared a sophia ex pre-patched using nocturnal sect when my co healer was a sch and couldn't handle the aoe demand for that fight specifically. that was with minimal item level as well but if you're speaking in terms of basic toolkits and the average player i would agree that ast is still very useable.

on another personal note i really miss disable and i wish the lady card was a more reliable clutch in most cases. but considering how many other classes got healing buffs i think it all depends on the perfect, co op team to really shine.

[Fernosaur]

????? How????

AST card system is literally more utility than both other healers put together. The Card system also IS part of our DPS. Raising the DPS or the entire team with balance, arrow, and spear is the reason out personal DPS skills are weaker. If we had the same power in our spells we would be obliterating the other two healers. You absolutely must take into account the card system when talking about AST DPS.

SCH's party utility isn't just DPS buffs, ie. Chain Stratagem and opener Fey Wind. The core of SCH's utility is the GCD and resource free healing output that Eos brings. NoctAST's cards cannot match the DPS windows SCH opens not only for themselves but for the other healer as well, given that NoctAST has absolutely no sustained HoT save for Collective, and has to sacrifice a great deal of personal DPS to do the same function, both for themselves and the WHM, a job which already suffers from GCD vs oGCD efficiency "problems."

SCH not only has shields that are now very competitive (and even unparalleled, in the case of a buffed Deployment), but also brings a very significant amount of HoTs that cost absolutely no GCD or MP in the form of Embrace, Whispering Dawn and Fey Union.

To make things a bit simpler, SCH is way, way more efficient at doing their base job, which is healing, and in turn helps the other healer be way more efficient as well, regardless of what job it is. This is the reason that A12S clears that tried to go double AST for the massive Balance uptime were still slower than the clears bringing a SCH.

I personally think the utility tools both bring are pretty comparable, but in the end I feel like SCH definitely wins out due to a bunch of factors already discussed in the thread.

[NobleWinter]

I was really hoping Astro would get a "Twilight" Ability in the Storm blood expansion that would allow them to execute their next Aspected Action in the opposing Sect. Being able to cast a barrier every 90 seconds in Diurnal or a HoT in Nocturnal would really solidify their healing toolkit.