Isn't it about time for WHM to get an AOE mitigation tool?

[Tridus]

Honestly I think they should just change secret of the lily 2 to make divine benison AoE when it consumes 3 lilies, I mean what a garbage level 68 skill, a 20% chance that something that happens about 20% of the time will proc a 5 second recast reduction on 2 already fairly short recast skills proced by a skill we rarely use? Come on... WHMs have been asking for an AoE mitigation tool for ages and we get that?

Be careful what you wish for. There's no way a trait is going to potentially increase DB's effectiveness to 8x of standard and give WHM arguably the strongest burst shield in the game (while only costing lilies). None. If they did this, DB would get nerfed massively.

Secret of the Lily II is so weak that you could remove it and almost nobody would even notice. It definitely needs addressing. This isn't the way. I'd rather them see do something like "20% on Cure/Cure 2 healing to make your next Stone instant" or some such, as that'd help you keep up personal DPS in situations where you're needing to use more Cure, effectively playing up something you want to be doing anyway without stepping on the toes of anyone else.

[Ghishlain]

You think divine Beninson is garbage? What world do you live in?

No, they're mentioning the level 68 skill, which is the trait "Secrets of the Lily II", is garbage. Which it is. A RNG chance to RNG chance to lower either the recast of Assize or Asylum (and the spell selected is RNG based? I dunno, this ability is rather hard to test in practice).

So yeah, getting a change to that trait would be nice. I don't agree with having this super charge Divine Benison into an AoE as a trait but it'd still probably be better than what it is now regardless.

I'd rather Secret of the Lily II just get scrapped for something else entirely right now, but just not sure what ATM.

[Sebazy]

I suspect that's just a case of poor wording and they are infact referring to Secret of the Lily II

Ooop, didn't spot the new page!

[ValentineSnow]

Be careful what you wish for. There's no way a trait is going to potentially increase DB's effectiveness to 8x of standard and give WHM arguably the strongest burst shield in the game (while only costing lilies). None. If they did this, DB would get nerfed massively.

Secret of the Lily II is so weak that you could remove it and almost nobody would even notice. It definitely needs addressing. This isn't the way. I'd rather them see do something like "20% on Cure/Cure 2 healing to make your next Stone instant" or some such, as that'd help you keep up personal DPS in situations where you're needing to use more Cure, effectively playing up something you want to be doing anyway without stepping on the toes of anyone else.

I dunno, thinking about it, it wouldn't be too unbalanced, let's look at it comparatively. succor and noct sect are about a 3k heal with 150% barrier, so about 4.5k AoE shield. at level 70 in i320 gear non-tanks have about 32k hp. benison is a 15% shield so about 4.8k AoE shield, a little stronger than ast and sch version. But ast and sch it's a GCD spell so they can spam it back to back, whm has a 24 second recast timer. whm's is free and oGCD while sch and ast cost 2k mp and a GCD, but whm also has to build 3 lilies which will cost at least 1500mp and 3 GCDs. Finally, ast and sch can buff their shield with largesse, fey illumination and dissipation, whm can't.

So while whm's shield would be stronger it would also come with built in drawbacks to offset that.

[MoroMurasaki]

So while whm's heal would be stronger it would also come with built in drawbacks to offset that.

But those drawbacks don't offset by remotely enough. Those other classes can spam a shield (not sure why, but okay) but WHM can spam Cure III and follow that up with a PI for 2,100 healing potency over about 7 seconds over the whole party.

[Sebazy]

I dunno, thinking about it, it wouldn't be too unbalanced

It would be disgustingly unbalanced in the endgame TBH =/

As an iLvl 340 healer with partial VIT melds I'm just below 37k with food. Raid buffed? I'm just shy of 40K and have room to surpass that if needed for Ultimate Coil.

So now we're talking a 6k oGCD barrier on the squishiest person on the party (going up to just shy of 11k on a warrior) with a 24 second cooldown. Not to mention that it'll completely ignore infirmity style debuffs and such.

The lily requirement is fluff, that would trivialise so much AoE stuff it's unreal. SE already got burned with fixed percentage based abilities via 2.x Lustrate. There's no way they will let this ability balloon out of control like we saw prior.

[Erakir]

snip

On top of this, even if this happened and its AoE strength were reduced to a smaller number like 8%, the bigger concern I'd have is its stackability with SCH/AST shields.

The last thing I want to see is a return to both healers having to shield the party with everything they've got to survive ults even when adequately geared. Succor + AoE Benison, Succor + CU, Aspected Helios + AoE Benison....nah, I'm good. I don't look back fondly on the memories of stoneskinning for 8 GCDs and watching people die if I didn't happen to start early enough.

[Exiled_Tonberry]

The lily requirement is fluff, that would trivialise so much AoE stuff it's unreal.

I don't disagree that an AOE Divine Bension wouldn't be hilariously op, but let's take a minute to look at what other healers have.

SCH has Indom, a 500 pot OGD 15y AOE on a 30 second CD. It almost always heals everyone but the tanks up to 100%. I would consider this trivializing AOE damage for sure.

AST has Earthly Star, a massive AOE heal that puts any other heal in the game to shame. It takes some coordination, but with good usage, this thing trivializes any AOE attack by itself.

Now in comparison, WHM doesn't actually have anything that's borderline broken like these two. Cure III on a GCD is nice, but it doesn't feel nearly as powerful as it did in 3.0 with other OGCD heals with much larger range beating it.
I'm not going to say AOE Bension isn't broken, but why is that a bad thing for WHM to have it's one truly powerful tool that trivializes damage?
Especially if it costs 3 lilies, which would mean preplanning 3 GCD heals, and not using Assize, Asylum or Tetragrammaton in-between this.

[Caduagm]

snip

Ah pls give cure 3 to ast if it\\'s not good then.

[Cabalabob]

Honestly I think they should just change secret of the lily 2 to make divine benison AoE when it consumes 3 lilies, I mean what a garbage level 68 skill, a 20% chance that something that happens about 20% of the time will proc a 5 second recast reduction on 2 already fairly short recast skills proced by a skill we rarely use? Come on... WHMs have been asking for an AoE mitigation tool for ages and we get that?

You think divine Beninson is garbage? What world do you live in?

Apparently one where people can’t read.

On top of this, even if this happened and its AoE strength were reduced to a smaller number like 8%, the bigger concern I'd have is its stackability with SCH/AST shields.

The last thing I want to see is a return to both healers having to shield the party with everything they've got to survive ults even when adequately geared. Succor + AoE Benison, Succor + CU, Aspected Helios + AoE Benison....nah, I'm good. I don't look back fondly on the memories of stoneskinning for 8 GCDs and watching people die if I didn't happen to start early enough.

So you’d rather if this situation arises that WHM just have no answer to it and be excluded from the content in favour of AST/SCH? I entirely agree with you stoneskinning 8 people sucked, having stoneskin 2 in combat would have remedied that. But this weird obsession people have with whm not being allowed any mitigation stands in the way of that.

You know it’s funny, where has this “no mitigation for whm” mindset even come from? It’s not like there’s some precedent for it. In ffxi whm was the shield healer having a stance that turned their cures into this games adloquium. 1.0 cnj had stoneskin and could AoE stoneskin. Protect, shell and wall are all classic mitigation white magic. So why is whm getting this mitigation stigma?

Ah pls give cure 3 to ast if it\\'s not good then.

I would trade it for earthly star any day.