Dating & Romance Rant

[ChaoticCrimson]

I can understand some of OP's frustrations. I was in a bad place for a while after my relationship of four years ended when it turned out my ex's feelings for me dwindled. We're still friends and all though, but she broke up with me not long after we graduated college. Here I was, heartbroken and back living with my parents, sending out tons of resumes for jobs in my field and working an internship with no pay. Needless to say my self-esteem was not at its highest, and it did not help my depression in the least. While I still haven't found someone special again since then, I have found a decent-paying stable job and my own place. I finally have the independence I've wanted for so long. I did have to move to a place where I don't know as many people, but I'm slowly making new friends. I guess my point is it's okay not to be in a relationship and work on other important goals in your life.

I do still sometimes struggle with my depression, and sometimes I feel lonely. Every so often I feel like hating myself even, but you know what? I do my best not to let those feelings define me. Because when you you let that negativity define you, then of course you won't be happy, and it'll affect your relationships as a result: Your platonic, your romantic, even your familial relationships. The fact is, I'm still pretty young, and I have plenty of time to meet someone. The same is true for you. Just get out there with the focus of making friends. NEVER underestimate the importance of friendship. If you keep at it, you might just be pleasantly surprised when you feel a real connection with someone after getting to know them. And if nothing else, you'll still have a new friend if you don't feel that spark. There are people who treat the "friendzone" as something bad, but what's wrong with friendship? Friendship, as I see has been mentioned before, should be the basis of a romantic relationship. Put a different way, a relationship should basically be a close friendship, just with more intimacy and romantic elements. Without that connection, you'll have a hard time maintaining that relationship. Yes, it takes time and work, and occasionally some compromise (though there is such a thing as too much compromise). In the end, if you truly care about someone, the two of you will be able to work together and ultimately compliment each other and build each other up in a positive way. So don't lose hope! Go, and make new friends! Fulfill your goals! You'll never know what it'll all lead to. Nothing is guaranteed, but there's also infinite possibilities!

[Wilford111]

If you refer to women as females that’s a good way to turn women away

I pretty much only use the terms "male" and "female" when I'm comparing or contrasting the two. I don't think that's an issue.

About my previous post, I kind of regret making it. It's not as if it's only girls giving that advice, guys are saying it too. I apologize.

I think the real problem here is that due to me not being a very social person, I don't have many friends; which is also why I feel so nervous about losing any. But I think the advice given in this topic, about putting myself out there and meeting new people as friends, is what I need to focus on. In addition to working on self esteem.

[Snow_Princess]

If you want "game dating" advice, just ask if you can do roulettes or something with them.

[Iromi]

To the females who are saying that a relationship is something that develops naturally out of a normal friendship.... I mean no disrespect, but I feel like that's not how it works of you're a male, since is traditionally up to the guys to make that push to relationship status. So it would make sense if, in a female's perspective, it would seem like it just happens.

Please forgive me if I'm wrong, I really don't want to come across as rude or ignorant. This is just how I feel about the situation.

I can see what you mean (tradition)..however, I don't think its something a guy has to make any push.

If it is meant to be it will happen between both..mutually. Forcing or pushing anything, again is an instant turn off, no matter how long I've known the person. It should ideally work out on its own without either one really saying anything. My BF I met on FFXI 8 years ago that I mentioned earlier? He did not in the slightest give me the impression that he was in love with me, and he wasn't from the start (before speaking with me). I am sure he thought I was attractive, but he didn't push anything on me at all. He was "normal" as in, didn't hit on me, didn't try to push any feelings onto me, that is why I talked to him.

In the end we both kind of said...we are falling for each other, nearly the same night we both wanted to say the same thing to each other, we did, and then I dropped my life for him and moved to NYC, no regrets. It's all about just letting things flow naturally.

[msAznLogikk]

Finding love is hard outside and inside the game. You just gotta put your best foot forward and hope for the best :3 How would you know if you never try? Although, love doesn't happen when you try to find it >_< The harder you look and expect love to come to you, it won't! All you have to do is to learn how to be happy on your own, and your positive energy will attract people. That's how I go about life anyways~ Having a boyfriend to play with would be nice, of course, but you just can't force it! If you're looking for just a playing companion, however, I'm always down to have someone to play with :3 And if things go well, who knows, it could always grow into more ♥

[raela]

To the females who are saying that a relationship is something that develops naturally out of a normal friendship.... I mean no disrespect, but I feel like that's not how it works of you're a male, since is traditionally up to the guys to make that push to relationship status. So it would make sense if, in a female's perspective, it would seem like it just happens.

Please forgive me if I'm wrong, I really don't want to come across as rude or ignorant. This is just how I feel about the situation.

I don't really agree, for either point. I guess I'm not exactly the traditional type of girl, but I've been the one to first express feelings in several of my previous relationships.

Buuuut, I also really dislike the attitude of "men and women can't just be friends, the guy is always on the prowl." I don't want every single guy that talks to me to size me up as a potential future partner within seconds of meeting me. Especially as that's essentially based entirely on looks, since personality takes time to get to know. But, I'm also not one who really lusts after looks.. I'm more attracted to the non-physical sides of a person.

Unless specifically first meeting someone through a dating website/app or being set up by a mutual friend, I don't see what's so strange about wanting to see if someone is fun to be around (pure friendship) before jumping to wondering about something more significant (dating).

[Tsumdere]

Playing into stereotypes such as "men have to be the first to ask out" just harms your self-esteem and hurts you in the long run.

Go out there and make friends. Women who like you will make it obvious. Women who don't... will just be friends. Nothing is more annoying than a man (or woman) who badgers you for a relationship when you have shown zero interest. Besides, using the friend method can lead you to an unexpected relationship with someone who you never imagined you would love in the first place.

[MoroMurasaki]

Playing into stereotypes such as "men have to be the first to ask out" just harms your self-esteem and hurts you in the long run.

I don't really agree with this as a blanket statement - there are certainly girls (myself included) who enjoy a guy who makes the first move. I think a lot of people (again guilty of this myself) have responded to this thread with advice tailored to what they find attractive about themselves or others.

In a way this is good, OP gets to see a lot of perspectives, but other than basic things like being confident and secure in yourself I don't think that a lot of advice on this subject is universal. Some girls like to be doted on, some will get annoyed if you so much as hold a door open for them. Some guys best bet is to get their foot in the door with their looks, others need to show off how smart or sensitive they are. These are all valid approaches to attracting and retaining a partner but they don't all apply to every situation

[Niraves]

Nothing is more annoying than a man (or woman) who badgers you for a relationship when you have shown zero interest.

100% this. If you come off as seeming almost desperate to be in a relationship, that can be very off-putting for people, men and women alike. I'm not into the whole dating thing, never really had much interest, but I've had friends on here who had 'feelings' for me before, and its just awkward when they keep trying to push you for something you're not interested in.

Just take your time, meet someone and be friends first. See where it goes.

[sarehptar]

Hey OP, I normally wouldn't go out of my way to offer any kind of romantic advice to anyone, but as I was reading your posts, I really got the sense that you're genuine and want to make things work, so I felt like I wanted to help any way I could. First let me preface this by saying that although my character is male, I'm a woman in real life, so my comments will come from that perspective. I just kind of want to break some things down...

You mention that you have low self-confidence and you aren't sure how to improve it. This is super understandable, many people feel this way. I agree with what other people on the thread have said--low self-confidence is noticeable to others, male or female, and people don't want to enter into a relationship with someone who has low self-confidence because there's this underlying idea that the insecure person is going to need constant reassurance, pick-me-ups, or attention to feel better about themselves. The relationship isn't a partnership in that situation--it's a burden the girl takes on in order to make the man feel better, and that's just not going to work. So how can you build your self-confidence? I feel like everyone's situation is unique, but here's some things I found personally helpful:

1) Diversify your skillset. Playing video games is great, but if that's all you can do well, you're going to start boring your potential girlfriend pretty quickly. Even for people who love video games, having just video games in common and just talking about video games all the time isn't super healthy. You need to have multiple topics you can talk about well, and multiple things you can go out and do. That way, when you enter into conversations, you'll always have some starting point or at least a better chance of making a connection through other shared hobbies. Take some time to try other things. If the gym isn't for you, try a community martial arts class! Not really into the idea of becoming a runner or a biker? Look up some hiking trails and take an easy hike. Got a few free hours you could volunteer instead of play video games? Check out ways you could help your local animal shelter, nonprofit organization, or youth groups. Being actively engaged with the world is attractive. Having more than one skill is attractive. And more than anything else, being good at more than one thing is attractive to people, because it shows just how much effort you're willing to put in all areas of your life.

2) Work on your appearance. This might sound shallow, but looks do play a part in attraction. Everyone has different tastes, of course, but you describe your appearance as "below average." Think very hard about this. Would you really want to date a woman whose appearance you would rate "below average"? (I mean, maybe you'd take anyone at this point, but I'm sure you'd prefer someone you're actually physically attracted to.) So do you think it's fair to expect women to be attracted to "below average"? I'm not saying you have to be gorgeous or that only gorgeous people get relationships! But make sure you put a little effort in. I don't know what you look like, so I can't give specific advice, but in general, buy some products to keep your skin clear, whiten your teeth, keep your hair/any facial hair neatly and consistently trimmed/shaved, make sure your fingernails are always in good condition, make sure that you're keeping up with daily hygiene (people who experience depression often struggle with this, so I thought I'd include it!). If you're "overweight," think about altering your diet a little at a time to eat healthier. I usually suggest this over joining a gym because it's an easier adjustment to make little by little than committing to a gym membership. You need to show that you take care of yourself. Because if you don't take care of yourself visually, how is she supposed to believe that you'll take care of your relationship together?

3) Practice open body language. The body language of shy people is often deliberately designed to discourage people from talking to you. Again, don't know you personally, but I bet there's a lot going on in your body language that's turning people away. Shy people often have closed off body language (eyes or even head facing down, shoulders more hunched, arms crossed, etc.) that actively discourages new people from wanting to talk to you, even when you didn't intend for that. Look up some guides on open and confident body language, and actually start practicing these moves. You can send a lot of unspoken messages to women without intending to, so start thinking about what you're "saying" to the women in your life. There's a lot of evidence that changing your body language through practice can actually change the way you feel about yourself, so this is important!

4) Look for romance in places that other people are looking for romance. I feel like the number one problem I've seen--and it's happened to me numerous times personally--is that men often try to make connections in places that seem inappropriate or poorly timed to me. Some girls like the idea of meeting people over video games, but others just want to game in peace and don't want to be pursued over the internet. (I mean, imagine if you lived your life with no safe zone, where even the virtual world was a place where people saw you as free game to hit on--that's how some women feel when you try to make overtures to them over video games!) A lot of times coworkers don't want to be flirted with; they just want to work. Girls going to a social club like an anime or video game club may just want to enjoy anime or video games, not have to fend off potentially unwanted romantic advances. Looking for a relationship in a group of people who haven't signaled that they are also looking for a relationship is extremely hit or miss. If those are the places you're actively looking for women, you're going to constantly run into the truth that probably around 90% of the girls you're meeting aren't even looking for a relationship, let alone open to the idea of a relationship with you personally. You're setting yourself up to fail. Look to become involved with more groups where the women who will be there have already signaled that they are looking for a relationship--muster all of your confidence and join some online dating services, especially those that hook you up with people in your local area. Bite the bullet and get involved with some events; you'd be amazed how many speed dating and other "meet and greet" events go on near you. When you focus your efforts on women who actually are looking for a relationship, you have a better chance of hitting the target, and you'll likely start to feel better about yourself, since more fish will be nibbling at your bait!

5) Actually talk about your feelings with people you know. I think it's nice that you're sharing your feelings with strangers on the internet, but we can't really reach out and have an impact on your personal, daily life. Take a deep breath and talk about some of these things with the people you actually know. You can tell people you know that you've been feeling lonely and would like to get more into dating. This is a feeling other people can really sympathize with! Obviously do it in a calm, not desperate-sounding way (and don't corner any women one-on-one with this, or they'll feel you're directing your feelings specifically at them), but share these thoughts with others. Your coworkers might have advice for you that's better tailored to your actual situation, or hey, they might know some available girls! Your friends who are girls, so long as you don't corner them, may have insight into how you could attract someone like them... Or you might find out that one of them has just been waiting for you to express some interest. Women (okay, at least I do!) appreciate men who are up-front and don't try to hide their intentions. When people know you want to date, they'll be more likely to either date you or help you find a date. And people who are brave enough to talk about their feelings are attractive, because it demonstrates they're willing to be open with you about who they "really are" inside. Being open and emotionally supportive are great foundations for a relationship!

6) Set realistic goals and reward yourself for achieving milestones. This might seem a little weird, but one massive problem I see with people is that they want to jump from 0 to 100 in an instant. You want to go from no relationship to great relationship immediately. Relationships--and your "date-ability"--have building blocks, just like every situation in life! If you want to work on your self-confidence, start small, with reasonable goals that you can actually attain. Set small goals first like "Go out and try one new thing a month" or "Say yes to hanging out with coworkers or friends one time when I normally would have stayed home." When you're working on your courage and confidence at talking to women, do the same thing, baby steps: "Give one girl I know a compliment (that isn't loaded/leading/creepy) that I wouldn't have otherwise said out loud." Little things build up into bigger things, and you have to set realistic expectations for yourself before you can get anywhere.


As for telling your female friends that you're attracted to them... I have been on both sides of this situation and it can be frustrating. I befriended a guy that I was attracted to from day one, but I wasn't brave enough to make the first move to ask him out because I didn't know how he felt about me. We hung out a ton, but I was never sure if it was supposed to be romantic or not, and I figured "If he hasn't made any more moves, maybe he's just not that into you." So I let it go. Lo and behold, after three years of knowing each other, when my attraction had faded into more platonic friendship and I was getting ready to make major changes in my life, all the sudden he tells me that he had feelings for me the whole time and just wasn't brave enough to tell me either. So this can really happen! And it's very sad when it does. However, I've also been in the other situation. Finding out that someone you only see platonically sees you romantically can be extremely uncomfortable to women. Women who are put into that situation become hyper-self-conscious of how they look and act around their male friend, trying desperately not to lead him on, trying to let him down gentle, etc. It puts the girl in a terrible place in which she honestly can't win--if she accepts the relationship because she feels forced to or out of pity, the relationship is miserable; if she turns her friend down, she then has to deal with the hurt and potential resentment he feels toward her. Think about how you would feel if you were put into that situation: a girl you thought you were just friends with, and have zero desire to date, suddenly stated she had had feelings for you for a while or even a long time. It's an awkward position to be in at best.

So I would recommend that you think carefully before expressing your feelings for your female friends. Think consciously about their actions. Have they ever given you ANY sign that they return your attraction? How eager are they to hang out with you one-on-one, just the two of you together? How eager are they to come over to your house by themselves? Have they ever made or given you any sign that they are looking for a relationship right now? I wouldn't say to over-analyze things, but make sure you look for some signs before you take this major step of expressing feelings for someone who wasn't expecting to be blindsided by that. And if you do express your attraction, make sure that you do it candidly and also gracefully give your friend a way out of the potentially bad situation. Something like "I don't want you to feel pressured to respond and I don't want to affect our friendship negatively, but I just wanted to let you know that I love spending time with you and, if you'd ever be interested in a date, I would love to take you. If not, that's absolutely fine too. Zero expectations and my feelings will recover if you say no, promise." If it's obvious that you're thinking about their feelings too and giving them a way to turn you down without feeling like monsters, they'll be less likely to want to break the friendship off even if they don't return your feelings.

And please for the love of god, don't try to pass dates/romantic outings with female friends off as platonic! This is so under-handed and men do this all the time! (Okay, I should say I've had it happen to me numerous times.) Guy will invite female friend out, female friend agrees under the pretense that it's just two friends hanging out... Then guy's feelings proceed to leak into everything they do together, so the "hang out" becomes increasingly uncomfortable for the girl--only she can't say no the next time he asks her to "hang out" because it's just a hang out, right? Not a romantic date? Just two friends, nothing more... This kind of thing puts women into a horrible position and really can sour a male-female friendship, so please, if this is what's happening in your life between you and your female friends, being honest about your feelings would be way, way better for everyone involved.

(Oh lord, I just realized how much of a text wall this is. Sorry, but I hope there's at least something helpful here.)