DRK AOE Damage

[Sarcatica]

I don't really want to argue much on this topic. But really, you make it sound that DRK is BLM in plate armor. When in fact, it doesn't matter which tank you have as long as your pulls big. Any good DPS will do three times your DPS "at least". And on bosses (single target) DRK is clearly the biggest loser in ST-DPS between the tanks so even if you did more AoE in packs, you slow the run on bosses.

You lost your own argument when you said WAR's personal DPS beats DRK's. Personal DPS is all there is to a tank's DPS since no tank brings a DPS buff. But WAR brings slashing so SAM and NIN don't have to apply it when AoEing. Unless you mean DPS gained from mitigation, then we're back to DRK having the worst of the three tanks in general, SPECIALLY in AoE. Let's not forget DRK is the only tank that doesn't want WHM to do Holy.

And I don't understand why you think picking mobs on WAR is hard because they don't have Flash. I never even cross-classed it when we could. I bet you pick up mobs with Unleash on DRK? Why? You can do the same with Abyssal Drain btw and it does more damage. I never had any loose mobs because of the overeager DPS that "want to just do their combos". Even with BLMs or monks going ape-poop insane. You just run in, angle yourself and press Overpower, and Voila! Everything's on you. The hitbox on it is RETARDEDLY big.

Also you said "Sheltron sucks in packs of mobs" in one paragraph and then say "Sheltron is really good I think, maybe." in the next. Which is it? Are you sure YOU know what you're talking about? Also you're undermining PLD's mitigation when PLD has 2 cooldowns over DRK. Every CD the DRK has the PLD has it or a better version of it. Both have Ramps, Sentinel is better than Shadow Wall. HG is better than LD. Both have Anticipation, and PLD has Bulwark. And Clemency on self is ironically more aggro than anything the DRK has. And yes HG is long, but the value is that when it's used, everyone (including the PLD) is free to just go full DPS.

Yes Shelton is bad on packs, but so is TBN really. 20% of health is what? 12k? That's less than a Cure II. Clemency heals more than that and can crit, and as I said earlier, generates massive enmity if done in ShO. You basically spend DA worth of MP to get a under a cure 2 worth of HP. An Adlo. Then it breaks and goes on a 15 second CD.

And from the sound of it you're attributing sub 15-minute dungeon clears completely to your tank choice because you make it sound that DRK does BLM-level of AoE damage. I'll be blunt and say it this way: The ONLY thing a tank can contribute to a speed dungeon clear is how big you can pull without sacrificing your healer's sanity, and how fast do you sprint between said pulls. Because in fact, believe it or not, it relies almost completely on who your DPS are. Casters that don't AoE or melee that do 1k DPS in AoE will make your dungeon last an eternity no matter how much YOU DPS. And an 8k DPS BLM will make you look bad no matter what tank you are.

Don't get me wrong though, DRK is really fun in AoE, probably the most fun of the three. It is my tank of choice in dungeons, but not because it does more or less than WAR or PLD, but because the whole thing with TBN, Quietus and MP management for near infinite AoE spam is fun. So if you find DRK your cup of tea in dungeons, by all means, go ahead. But let's stop pretending that fast clears are all because of DRK's AoE DPS.

~ Phoenicia ~

This is why people should learn to understand first before replying. Since when did I mention that DRK's dmg is superior? WAR is superior in vacuum but you fail to mention healer's dps. You clearly do not understand the value of party DPS, WAR additional damage has a huge price weighing down healer's dps. WHM's Holy is only 6 secs stuns, you barely gain anything much from that which means that DRK should always play around that 6 secs and have more mana ready for next pulls. Sheltron's mitigation on an autoattack is like 400-600dmg, VS TBN at 11k. You are basically freeing your healer to top up more while you are also sustaining as a DRK. Clemency is a GCD loss, DAAD isn't and it does both dps and heal, what are you trying to say? WAR isn't anywhere better as well. DRK is the job that you want to bring if you have a competent team. Fastest clear by far has been DRK for me in all DREX, that says a lot and I can't achieve those timings as WAR/PLD as a matter of fact.

I don't really want to argue much on this topic. But really, you make it sound that DRK is BLM in plate armor. When in fact, it doesn't matter which tank you have as long as your pulls big. Any good DPS will do three times your DPS "at least". And on bosses (single target) DRK is clearly the biggest loser in ST-DPS between the tanks so even if you did more AoE in packs, you slow the run on bosses.

You also lost your argument when you mention that a good DPS should TRIPLE a tank's dps. That's just plain wrong and you don't even have the data to support that claim.

16,248 DPS total

I average about 2.5-3k damage depending on how fast or how slow the group is, does that mean that a DPS should be doing 7k++ at least? That's bullshit. Great DPS average at 5k++ dps each easily but that's not triple a tank's dps. UNLESS if you ARE doing 2k or less, then I will shut up. LUL

Don't even try to walk this way out tell that I'm wrong etc and the "I pay my sub, I do what I want" or "This is just a game, wtf so HC" or whatever reasons you can think of. I have more data if you want, but I will let it sink for now. Don't expose your opinions as the 'fact' when you can't prove it.

People like to think in vacuum but that's not how things work. Prove it if WAR is any better, but have some data for me to see at least.