Co-Op Dungeons (for DoW/DoM and DoL)

[Manafont]

when do you see a DOH/DOL going into a dungeon in any fantasy? Any movie, show, book. They take up ARMS and fight. they are no longer a blacksmith, or farmer, or fisherman. Stop asking for a dungeon to support a class that's never going to battle. thats a wasted dungeon. you wanna fight level a DOM/DOW

[Jigg]

when do you see a DOH/DOL going into a dungeon in any fantasy? Any movie, show, book. They take up ARMS and fight. they are no longer a blacksmith, or farmer, or fisherman. Stop asking for a dungeon to support a class that's never going to battle. thats a wasted dungeon. you wanna fight level a DOM/DOW

How about Indiana Jones? He's an Archeologist (Gatherer), not a fighter...he just happens to know how to use a whip and a gun.

[Kiote]

Yoshida's blatant dismissal of this kind of possibility is a testimate to how little he cares about anything but Battle. He calls it too stressful but that what a challenge is. A hard dungeon will be stressful regardless of how it must be completed. Incorperating DoL/H would allow for a level of depth that is unheard of in MMOs today. The ability to make secondary passages or defensive positions inside of a dungeons would be the first real challenge implemented in this game. Yoshida is just blissfully ignorant of the possibility of puzzle being better than speed runs.

[Jigg]

Yoshida's blatant dismissal of this kind of possibility is a testimate to how little he cares about anything but Battle. He calls it too stressful but that what a challenge is. A hard dungeon will be stressful regardless of how it must be completed. Incorperating DoL/H would allow for a level of depth that is unheard of in MMOs today. The ability to make secondary passages or defensive positions inside of a dungeons would be the first real challenge implemented in this game. Yoshida is just blissfully ignorant of the possibility of puzzle being better than speed runs.

You bring up a good point that can be applied probably better elsewhere for DoH...fortifications. Say having to board up/ bar up/ repair portions of a fortification during waves of attacks.

[Nakiamiie]

**??What?? to the part I bolded

[RemVye]

Yoshida's blatant dismissal of this kind of possibility is a testimate to how little he cares about anything but Battle. He calls it too stressful but that what a challenge is. A hard dungeon will be stressful regardless of how it must be completed. Incorperating DoL/H would allow for a level of depth that is unheard of in MMOs today. The ability to make secondary passages or defensive positions inside of a dungeons would be the first real challenge implemented in this game. Yoshida is just blissfully ignorant of the possibility of puzzle being better than speed runs.

Arrogance is a stinky cologne. Yoshi is not ignorant. He only stated with 90+% of people know to be true... crafters and gathers are secondary hobbies in the game and should not be part of battle content.

Read my previous posts for details on why it would fail. The community is predictable, whatever the easiest route to the finish will be taken.

[RemVye]

I don't speak in cat pictures, maybe you could translate.

[Kiote]

Arrogance is a stinky cologne. Yoshi is not ignorant. He only stated with 90+% of people know to be true... crafters and gathers are secondary hobbies in the game and should not be part of battle content.

Read my previous posts for details on why it would fail. The community is predictable, whatever the easiest route to the finish will be taken.

90+% of people don't want DoL/H to fight or to be able to talk there way through a fright. People would readily accept content that incorperated other classes into making more in depths experiences

That is why you make multiple endings to a dungeon. Paths that require assistance or thinking. Battle content with no challenge last less than a month.

[Nakiamiie]

**??What?? to the part I bolded

Except it's still annoying. I won't be the only one to think it's annoying. If i have to get naked, put my crafting stuff on, then get naked again, put my fighting stuff on and now have my cooldowns all maxed out I'm gonna be annoyed.

Doesn't matter what you say, Yoshi is against it. "We may try it once" and I can bet he said that with baited breath and hesitance.

Unless they also streamline changing classes and equipment this is going to just be annoying, my opinion.

The bigger picture here is this is supposed to be content for DoL/H, right? I'd have to say the majority of people don't like doing these things, but have spent time in them to progress there character. It's a huge assumption on my part, but I don't know a single person who "enjoys" crafting currently.

Anyway, so these people given the choice... A.) Complete an instance as battle class OR B.) Complete a dungeon as DoL/H class... most would pick A. So for the few people who actually main class as DoL/H, and don't enjoy battle classes for whatever reason... this content would almost be out of reach because - like I said before - if I were to look for people for this type of instance, I would choose someone who can fight and craft or just a crafter.

Also... at the point where they would actually implement this.. how many people won't have any crafting / gathering classes leveled? Or know several people who do? It just seems like wasted effort to put work into a DoL/H involved dungeon when a ton of the current player base has a lot of this stuff leveled.


How about a simple NPC who follows behind you and does all that stuff, and you protect him as he crafts, opens doors, gets stuff, etc.?

I have voiced my opinion about it already. The fact remains there is demand for it even if it's not something you would like to do.

[Nakiamiie]

I don't speak in cat pictures, maybe you could translate.

It's ok, forget about it. I removed it from the post.

Edit: Forgot this:

If i have to get naked, put my crafting stuff on, then get naked again, put my fighting stuff on and now have my cooldowns all maxed out I'm gonna be annoyed.

Ya, me too.
That's why I support optimal level/favoured class.
And cooldowns should not reset anymore (with a few exceptions).

Still, the problem for that is not the mixed dungeon, it's the character coding. We are already faced with that problem for minor synthesis on the spot or rapid class switch.