Dear Healers who don't DPS

[Sebazy]

Please open up the party finder, and tell me you don't see :

"Skip mechanics or kick"
"High DPS or kick"
"Healer DPS or kick."
"Know the fight perfectly"
"2 mistakes --> kick"
"One mistake, disband!"
"No bad please"

I see a no bad please and no stupid fail. Both for O3S so a pretty fair request for rather challenging content that needs a solid standard of play to clear within PF, there's a few mount farms stating high dps as well but that's about it. The rest is kill parties and such for various bits of content.

I don't see a single PF mentioning healer DPS nor have I noticed that with any degree of regularity. Certainly isn't one right now.

Pls stop exaggerating perhaps?

Even FC recruitments or static recruitments are the same. I mean come on, no need to be hypocritical

This is a weird one TBH and for the much part a very valid point, certainly far more so than the PF comments thing. It's mildly amusing seeing statics that are still progressing on content with echo seeking 'exceptional' candidates.

You'll typically find that it's the more hardcore teams refilling members due to the inevitable turnover and burnout you see at this level that are outwardly recruiting players that from midcore or even casual teams and FCs that want to make the step up. By comparison, successful casual and midcore teams will tend to pool players from within their various circles and/or word of mouth between friends rather than advertising all the time.

[Taika]

Please open up the party finder, and tell me you don't see[...]

That puts a ton of stress on players - not just healers - there's no denying it

I have to say I've never seen a "healer DPS or kick" party finder, but yeah I've seen those "1 mistake and kick" groups. You know how to best deal with them? Don't join them. People have every right to form whatever types of groups they want, and people also hold the power of choosing to join or not to join them.

I only join "please be patient and expect some wipes" ones, and those are the ones I start myself too, even if I'm perfectly experienced with the fight myself. The player community of this game is what we make it to be.

[Maeka]

Such is precisely why I don't bother with PF unless I want a hunt or boss FATE.

No thanks.

It stinks of the same stench as WoW PUGs, where they would go "LFM blahblah raid, GS blah blah (overgeared for the content), MUST HAVE ACHIEVES!" when they themselves are undergeared, and are missing the achievements.

You tell these people that they're being stupid and they go "You want achievements? JOIN A RAIDING GUILD!" . uh, except raiding guilds want the same thing. The whole PURPOSE of joining a PUG is BECAUSE I can't do a raiding guild due to variable hour job IRL. So... yah, they expect you to have the achievements, know the fight, and have all the gear from the raid before you ever step foot inside said raid. lol.

God Forbid anybody ever wipe on a boss, right? Oi.

So I don't bother. I didn't bother with it in WoW before I quit that awful game, and I don't bother with PF here. I'm glad I have myself a nice little FC with nice players, that's all I need. If I can't do it through the Duty Finder or with FC, then I simply won't do it at all.

[cgbspender]

You are right. I don't join Party Finder groups. But that was not my point. My point was to try to explain why some players refuse to minmax/optimize/heal'dps. The core of the issue is he same as why there are so few tanks and healers out there. Healers try to dps and cause a wipe by inexperience ? They get insulted or kicked, or cause a party to disband in case of PF. Tanks try to get better at stance-dancing and cause a wipe. Guess what happens next ?

And don't get me wrong, I'm not against dps'ing as a healer. In fact, I do dps a damn lot. On the other hand, I fully understand those who don't. It's often not worth it, considering the harsh non-constructive criticisim and insults they get when they fail at trying.

[Anarism]

Healers try to dps and cause a wipe by inexperience ? They get insulted or kicked, or cause a party to disband in case of PF. Tanks try to get better at stance-dancing and cause a wipe. Guess what happens next ?

I've had the odd case where I Malefic/Stoned myself into a bored torpor and didn't realize someone was suddenly dying. I apologized, everyone shrugged, we moved on. Sure, I've had my share of toxic gamer trash losing their mind and getting abusive over nothing - usually caused by themselves, bonus points if it's a mentor - and yeah, those cases stick a lot longer with you than the others, but you still vastly overstate how little tolerance people allegedly have for mistakes in this game. Even in DF/PF.

[Cynfael]

The core of the issue is he same as why there are so few tanks and healers out there. Healers try to dps and cause a wipe by inexperience ? They get insulted or kicked, or cause a party to disband in case of PF. Tanks try to get better at stance-dancing and cause a wipe. Guess what happens next ?

Life goes on. Besides, with toggle CS being gone, the risk of failing disastrously (which wasn't that big of a thing to begin with) is also gone.

Personally I don't expect other tanks and healers to do the bare minimum forever for fear of making a mistake. It's also very realistic for players to learn gradually; what we're talking about isn't so difficult that people have to crash and burn horribly in order to get the hang of it.

[Deceptus]

And there ARE times where standing still for a few seconds is beneficial such as when something is almost dead and there's no real point in trying to squeeze that one last Stone IV in before it dies (which the DPS will probably have it dead before you even finish casting anyways)

And then everyone thinks this so you have that one mob at 2% that won't die and is still causing damage to your tank.

[Maeka]

And then everyone thinks this so you have that one mob at 2% that won't die and is still causing damage to your tank.

If your DPS is standing there not attacking that 2% left mob, then they are simply not doing their job. The tank AND the DPS should still be attacking mobs at all times; the tank to maintain threat, and DPS because killing junk is their job. In fact, NIN/SAM/BRD has execute skills designed specifically for this purpose.

It shouldn't fall to the healer of all people to finish off almost-dead mobs. That's just ludicrous. DPS are given skills that allow them to go on forever without having to worry about MP. Melees never run out of TP (unless they are spamming AoE which they shouldn't be for long). A Healer who is out of MP, though, is dead weight to the group and will likely cause a wipe if the mob/boss doesn't die or someone/something gives the healer some MP.

Therefore, it is better that the healer not waste MP when it is not necessary. DPS is icing on the cake for a healer; not their primary duty.

[Miste]

If this is all true, it sounds like you had a bot for a healer using a script that did exactly what you said. Bene 1 if tank get below 90%, other than that keep up asp.ben suring battles. It is much harder to script movement out of AoE telegraphs (not even sure it is possible) so that totally sounds like a bot.

I only gave two examples of that healer's behavior. Their playstyle was not static for the whole run so it wasn't a bot. They almost never used cards, but once in awhile they would remember and use it...

After they got hit by the magitek cannon they didn't even react for 10 seconds or so, a bot would have healed itself much faster than that, but they dodged some of the floor telegraphs just fine earlier in the dungeon. They were just watching a movie or barely paying attention for sure by the time we beat first boss.

Also that dungeon is not possible with a healer bot that is that slow at reacting that it cannot even dodge a circle aoe or even heal itself right away when it takes more than half its health in damage...due to the bosses. We would have wiped on the first boss there are many things to dodge and second boss has towers you need to stand in and stack markers which this healer did attempt to do. I mean if the healer is a bot then they would for sure have died which will cause a full wipe eventually as we slowly die without any heals.

Also they chatted some with one of the DPS, it wasn't a bot, nor would you ever be able to clear a dungeon with a bot that bad even if it was one.

This isn't my only encounter recently either if you want more examples that this kind of thing happens. I had a level 70 WHM healer in ARF that just spammed Cure I on me over and over even if I had no HP gone, but they weren't a bot because their playstyle was not static, sometimes they would stop curing me and sit there for awhile at full MP and do nothing then go back to Cure I spam and use Medica II once in awhile even though everyone's HP was full. They also did mechanics in the boss fights like the missile the second boss does...no bot would be able to do that.

I think you are unfortunately wishing that a healer this lacking didn't exist and it would make more sense to call them a bot because naturally you would hope no one could possibly be that noncontributing when they are level 70 and has some omega gear and should know the game decently well by then, but they do exist and I've seen it often enough to make me not want to DF on anything but myself on healer.

So an AST who used cards maybe 3 times the entire 20 mins, only used Benefic I and Asp. Benefic out of his entire toolkit and a WHM who only used Cure I and Medica II out of their entire toolkit. Both level 70 with i300-i320 gear and one being a mentor as well. They used like 5% of their toolkits.

I mean if I compared this to my WAR it means I would only have to use Overpower enough to hold hate then use idk..Rampart then I get to sit there and watch a movie until the DPS kill the mobs for me. DPS isn't my job right.

A Healer who is out of MP, though, is dead weight to the group and will likely cause a wipe if the mob/boss doesn't die or someone/something gives the healer some MP.

Therefore, it is better that the healer not waste MP when it is not necessary. DPS is icing on the cake for a healer; not their primary duty.

You should not be running out of MP on any healer for any content outside of savage unless people are dying left, right, and center....but if those people are dying due to their own mistakes then that isn't your fault anyway.

No one expects you to DPS if there is a lot of healing needed because people are failing mechanics and dying and you are forced to scrape people off the floor and lacking MP due to all of that extra healing and raising...otherwise you should definitely not be running out of MP.

I mean MP isn't even really an argument you can make, because none of us would want a healer to DPS so hard they run out of MP and can no longer heal. You aren't going to run out of MP just contributing some DPS spells here and there. If you somehow do then there is a seriously bad underlying problem with how you manage your MP and MP recovery abilities or there is something wrong in the group like people failing mechanics/dying like I mentioned above, but again if people are dying no one cares if you aren't DPSing.

[Taika]

My point was to try to explain why some players refuse to minmax/optimize/heal'dps. The core of the issue is he same as why there are so few tanks and healers out there. Healers try to dps and cause a wipe by inexperience ? They get insulted or kicked, or cause a party to disband in case of PF. Tanks try to get better at stance-dancing and cause a wipe. Guess what happens next ?

So you're saying some people don't want to even try to play their jobs well, because they're afraid they'll mess up and get negative feedback from others?

To me that doesn't make much sense. Mistakes happen to everyone. When I mess up I apologise and we move on. From my experience, people tend to appreciate trying and failing more than not trying at all.