Periodic Warrior complaint thread episode 2

[LadyCeles]

there already working on shake it off. U have the highest dps and fastest mitigation cds. Ur potential is highest as MT or OT. When speed kills come in to play ull be what everyone wants. Just cause ur not overpowered like in HW.

[Kothos]

And behold the ultimate opinion from someone that don't even lvled war to 70. Yeah !

[Umbeliel]

By popular (static) demands I cured my warrior condition by identifying myself as paladin. snip snip and others saying similar things

They're competitive... only in so far as dps. TBN is a ridiculously powerful tool(and drk's only tool lol) and Warrior just... brings nothing but 10~15% personal dps. It's really not worth taking a Warrior over a Dark Knight unless survivability is a -complete- non issue... even then it's still splitting hairs.

My main question is how much we want Warrior to revolve around specific windows and opportunities of play, each of which is painfully vulnerable to desync due to deaths or mechanics. snip snip

You know, honestly, in spite of it seeming like the majority opinion... I really would rather NOT have our dps increased. I don't want to only do dps... Utility and identity- neither of which are personal dps(kinda). I'd like SOME sort of active interaction with other party members, or at least our self sustain back to where it was at bare minimum. I'd really like if IB's heal was buffed or something too.

I sort of feel like Unchained needs to give a buff to the skills that ignore the defiance penalty in the first place. snip snip

Agreed pretty much across the board... kind of. I've actually found that my burst lines up on 6th gcd very comfortably.

And behold the ultimate opinion from someone that don't even lvled war to 70. Yeah !

I love this. lmao



A fine group of tanks whose only unique ability is apparently to get super mad about things and do the same thing as the other tanks but a little worse.

[SyzzleSpark]

They're competitive... only in so far as dps. TBN is a ridiculously powerful tool(and drk's only tool lol) and Warrior just... brings nothing but 10~15% personal dps. It's really not worth taking a Warrior over a Dark Knight unless survivability is a -complete- non issue... even then it's still splitting hairs.

TBN is not ridiculously powerful nor is it really utility, because a 5-5.2K shield is not powerful to replace a cooldown in your co-tank's rotation. Every tank is perfectly capable of surviving comfortably even out of stance without it.

WAR offers considerably more DPS since the 4.05 changes, and more survivability. The only reason DRK was taken during early progression was because WAR was "broken" for the first few weeks. If you look at fflogs, WAR is offering about 8% more raid DPS over a DRK, which is quite significant. 4.05 literally gave WARs everything they asked for on a platinum platter other than a fix to Shake it Off.

You could have a non-WAR MT and have a DRK shielding them, or you could just have a WAR MT and get overall better mitigation and DPS, and then a PLD OT using Intervention/cover on them at no personal cost. WAR MT/PLD OT is pretty much the god comp right now. Granted you don't lose much by taking a DRK instead of one of those, but why bother?

[Umbeliel]

snip

You're defending something that doesn't really need defending. TBN is ridiculously powerful compared to Warrior's nothing. 5k is roughly equivalent to a 10% cd on a 50k hit- given TBN's availability, this is very very good. It's not enough to make up for drk's whole kit, but that's a separate issue entirely. The point of TBN being strong doesn't mitigate the fact that the rest of drk's kit is lacking, or that drk doesn't need buffs also if that's what bothered you.

As of right now, the top Warrior on o1s is 3897.9, and o2s is 3888 exactly. The top drk is 3772.2 and 3716... which is quite a bit higher than your average drk so let's go ahead and take the #2s at 3767.1 and 3628.1 respectively. About(rounded up) a 5% increase in personal dps, not raid. Both drk and war need more than they've gotten so far, and I'm not sure why you're even trying to push back against that at all really. No, it wasn't everything we asked for. If you think all we wanted, on the large, was to be a cleave bot you maybe haven't been listening very closely.

Edited to add links, too.

[Tegernako]

4.05 literally gave WARs everything they asked for on a platinum platter other than a fix to Shake it Off.

1. I'm honestly getting really tired of you trying to bring down WAR players because you don't like DRK right now.

2. It's not everything we asked for.

3. We got given that change quick because one of the core issues with our job was a simple fix. The issues with DRK are a bit deeper then letting us stance dance again. Hence why it would take more time.

[Capn_Goggles]

snip

WAR absolutely did not get "everything it wanted handed on a platinum platter" beyond reverting the asinine penalty to stance-dancing. Yeah DRK is in a really crappy spot right now for a multitude of reasons, and is definitely the worst off, but WAR being the better of the two is akin to picking the guy without legs rather than the coma patient for your football team.

Onslaught is still never touched outside of the infuriate window, infuriate still renders unchained entirely useless, and our higher DPS comes at the cost of being slapped down by every mechanic under the sun.

[Mycow8me]

Cant really comment on shake it off since changes are coming for it... Just have to wait and see.

Think op is kinda being a drama queen but war does feel vastly different from its 2.0 and 3.0 counterpart... I feel like bloodbath was a staple skill to the overall feel of warrior after having it so long but whatever. I miss my hp gained through attacking feel warrior used to have. The changes to steel cyclone were great but it doesn't feel like it was enough. Still disappointed with unchained... Seems ironic, I would think unchained be some iconic skill related to tanking since its a defiance only skill but whatever...

I miss 3.0's warrior for the overall feel of it. I don't care if the dps standard and gap between the other tanks was lower. I guess they herd we liek fel cleaving while we fel cleave so they put some fel cleave into our fel cleave so we can fel cleave while maximizing fel cleaving. I honestly thought 4 was enough possibly IR could have been a 50% damage boost to gauge skills and a small skill speed boost instead of halving the gauge cost. 4fel cleaves with +50% damage would theoretically be 6 fel cleaves.

Dunno really, wars my favorite class and I still like it but it definitely feels lost in transit to 4.0... Can't even imagine what the dork knights have been going through.

EDIT: On the topic of self sustain if they don't want to give us some kind of HP gained through attacking skill... They could at the very least make IB heal% vary with current HP. The lower your HP the higher the heal % up to some number that SE sees fit with the idea of giving wars a bit more self sustain.

[Galgarion]

Would it be a bad thing if berserk's cooldown was shortened to 40 seconds? It's such an important tool. When I've got infuriate and berserk ready to go with a full beast guage, I feel pretty good when I'm chopping something up, but during my 'building phase' when I'm waiting for cool downs to end and I'm back to building guage on the next target, it feels like it takes too long to kill something. I hate being so reliant on burst.

[aleph_null]

War has always been the bursty type in terms of dps. Outside berserk drk beat us even back in 3.x. It was very evident in post echo a11s runs for example, where generally you either have to choose between holding your second berserk until the pyretic phase starts, or lose a few sec of berserk if you pop it after the first limit cut. In either case if you check the interval in which you don't use berserk, the drk should be quite a bit higher than you.