Victimize recast and Simian Thrash

[Black-Cat]

It's shame how many people think Simian thrash is useless due to the evade requirement. If you want to spam it, toss up featherfoot and use cover on whomever has the hate. You will be able to spam it all day. Just remember hate will be hard to pull off you if you use it over and over on bosses.

[Vackashken]

It's shame how many people think Simian thrash is useless due to the evade requirement. If you want to spam it, toss up featherfoot and use cover on whomever has the hate. You will be able to spam it all day. Just remember hate will be hard to pull off you if you use it over and over on bosses.

............. lol, what?

[Black-Cat]

I find Pugilist to be an amazing DD. You may play it different then I do but the way I play starts off with building 3000TP. Stand in front of the person with hate and face them. Use Presence of Mind then Featherfoot. Hit Cover and wait for the evade. When I evade I turn and use Simian. If I don't have hate I quickly move from out in front of the tank and run behind the mob. Invigorate, Pummel, Flurry and light strike. 3000TP again. Buff, Blindside and Victimize. I'm now the tank.

And the timers with Cover/Simian work out to just keep doing it. When I hit 50 I just fell in love with this class.

[Akk]

I'm happy for you, but you should wait as long as you're able before attempting Ifrit as Pugilist. Ifrit has made me kind of disappointed in Pugilists at the moment. We're about as useful as Archers on that fight, and we don't even get to Simian Thrash him.

[Gidonoidon_Sur]

One thing I noticed on these forums is that people think all classes should be equal. Not true. Some classes will be better at some things then others and in different situations. PGL has higher evasion then other DDs. So in a standard party, in which it isn't serving any tanking role, of course it will and should put out less damage. Just remember that PGL (insert any other class here) are classes and are meant to be a little more flexible. Not everyone can be DPS king. Also, this game is still in alpha so it is likely to go through major changes before we can actually judge the merits of any one class in total fashion.

All that said, I am not saying we shouldn't have discussions on the future of these classes but just remember they are unfinished and likely to change.

[Meleena]

We're about as useful as Archers on that fight,

Not true, Keen flurry can help deal tons of damage and we have auto attack so we can avoid being animation locked.
Our problems start after Hellfire but again, were still better than archers for this.

[Akk]

One thing I noticed on these forums is that people think all classes should be equal. Not true. Some classes will be better at some things then others and in different situations. PGL has higher evasion then other DDs. So in a standard party, in which it isn't serving any tanking role, of course it will and should put out less damage. Just remember that PGL (insert any other class here) are classes and are meant to be a little more flexible. Not everyone can be DPS king. Also, this game is still in alpha so it is likely to go through major changes before we can actually judge the merits of any one class in total fashion.

All that said, I am not saying we shouldn't have discussions on the future of these classes but just remember they are unfinished and likely to change.

I "liked" your post, buuuuut...

I can live with never being the DPS king or (drag) queen, AS LONG AS I CAN PUT THE TARGET INTO SUBMISSION WITH MY BLUE BALLS OF POWER! : P

(Evidenced by the fact that I've neglected to post any negative feedback about Pugilist until now.)


@Meleena
I'm well aware of Keen Flurry+Victimize, but that doesn't come close to making up the difference in power and DPS of polearm range and Doomspike. And to do our best DPS we need to use mana for our basic attacks and Seismic Shock, and we need our mana to heal ourselves from the Sear+Burst damage.

[Meleena]

I'm well aware of Keen Flurry+Victimize, but that doesn't come close to making up the difference in power and DPS of polearm range and Doomspike. And to do our best DPS we need to use mana for our basic attacks and Seismic Shock, and we need our mana to heal ourselves from the Sear+Burst damage.

Seismic shock on Ifrit? You don't need it.
I have outDDed Lancers and Marauders without using it.
You don't need to be top DDer, you just need to win the fight right?

[Physic]

One thing I noticed on these forums is that people think all classes should be equal. Not true. Some classes will be better at some things then others and in different situations. PGL has higher evasion then other DDs. So in a standard party, in which it isn't serving any tanking role, of course it will and should put out less damage. Just remember that PGL (insert any other class here) are classes and are meant to be a little more flexible. Not everyone can be DPS king. Also, this game is still in alpha so it is likely to go through major changes before we can actually judge the merits of any one class in total fashion.

All that said, I am not saying we shouldn't have discussions on the future of these classes but just remember they are unfinished and likely to change.

actually pug doesnt have any more evasion than anyone else, evasion is now its own stat, and nothing alters it but level and gear. Btw none of the evasion gear is exclusive to pug, in fact most of it is usable by like 8 other jobs. The other thing you should know, is that pugilist no longer has much more survivability than a lancer, lancer gets about 80 more defense and has the same hp, dodging is nice, but we have only 8 more seconds of enhanced evasion than anyone else. trust me, right now the evasion doesnt really make up the difference

Now i enjoy the mechanic of a powerful move that you can only do as a counter, however noow that victimize is 60 seconds, it leaves a large whole in our damage repetoire.

Btw, the balance for pugilist power is that it has an extremely short attack range, and that it is by and large a single target fighter, they wouldnt need to gimp our dps, even if we did have better defensive stats.

[Akk]

Seismic shock on Ifrit? You don't need it.
I have outDDed Lancers and Marauders without using it.
You don't need to be top DDer, you just need to win the fight right?

Oh, I have too. But have you ever tried competing with 25+ DPS Lancers? It's a fun game I like to fail at hardcore.

Edit: 25+ DPS Lancers who take *way less than* half of the AE damage I do, due to being able to avoid Sear completely, have a better chance at avoiding Burst, and not have to worry as much about Eruption positions because there should be no one behind them ever.