Not again...

[Zumi]

If I had to guess the cast time on holy spirit will go up to 3 seconds doubling the time it takes to cast. Guess we will find out what they actually do in 3 days.

[SunAurel]

So.. I'll ask again.. why are "some" ppl are going crazy about the pld nerf and talking about the meta while the current pld does 200+ more dps than war (talking about dps only) and drk is even below war? Can I get a sane pld who's not screaming or going crazy while trying to explain?

we are not going crazy about the warrior / drk buffs, we stand behind them and they were needed
we are against an additional nerf to paladin with those buffs

[MyaValentine]

So.. I'll ask again.. trying to explain?

Because you are assuming that anyone in their right mind is saying that currently all tanks are balance, they are obviously not paladin currently has the highest dps and that's a fact, no one wants warrior to be this underpowered nor DRK WHICH is why we are glad they are getting buffed. What it's not right is nerfing pld but buffing them at the same time because we risk the same situation warrior is on right now but back again in heavenward style, with all the tank balance properly buff wise, there's no more party buff that offers more raid damage, the only factor left is personal dps and if we switch the spots now war gets buffed to be over 300+ dps over paladin guess who's gonna be once again preferred tank class for every single raid, right now what we need is the other 2 tanks up at the lvl of paladin and we've done it, we achieve tank balance. they all can mitigate and damage, extra utility tools won't kill one or the other along as the damage are fair. no one is going to pick a paladin over a warrior for clemency or a 15% raid shield that scholars and astro already can offer, I will be ok with war doing slightly more damage since they don't get a tank buster pt shield like paladin or DRK does but not so much extra that It will negate the other 2 utility.

also the main fuzz with this nerf is not the damage, I can atlas speak for myself that damage is the least of my concern but it's how the class feels, currently old feels complete, fun and powerful enough to feel than I'm not hitting wet noodles, the nerf is coming in the form of a slower cast time of HS which means we will not be able to properly use or mana, fit the same amount of holy spirit in the requiescats window and we will not be able to wage abilities in between hence making the class clunky more slow and fucks with the timing of the rotation and this is what bothers me I'd rather get a potency nerf than this.

[VargasVermillion]

Speak for yourself. I didn't roll a job with a two-handed weapon to be out-damaged by a sword-and-board, personally.

Yet you're ok with being out damaged by a job that punches things? Or one using a katana which in the real world is almost exactly the same as European sword in function?

[Cerith]

Square-Enix-sama, Please do not nerf Holy Spirit on Paladin. I love the idea of buffing the other tank jobs power.
However that combined with nerfs to paladin, would spell for another repeat of us being a Joke tank for yet another expansion.
Plan on instantly quitting PLD if Holy spirit is nerfed.

One additional suggestion I'd like to make for DRK is to increase plunge distance from 15yrd to 20yrd so it will be the same as all other gap closers.
Having so much fun playing PLD (my original class) please don't nerf it again.

[Harz]

Yet you're ok with being out damaged by a job that punches things? Or one using a katana which in the real world is almost exactly the same as European sword in function?

Worse than a european sword, really. Far less versatile.

[Cadmus]

Seems they're just going to nerf pld and buff the others to make it the same situation as it was in HW. And PLDs don't complain as much as Warrs (just a different mentality of the players), so it's never going to get fixed then.
But PLD has raid-saver tier utility. So I'll still be playing it.

[DWolfwood]

Utility that comes at the cost of DPS is not practical, but PLD has loads of practical utility, and by far the most. It costs them nothing to use Intervention and Divine Veil is still an easy to use mitigation tool for raid wide damage. Passage of Arms' place will be debatable because it really only is practical for phase transitions and we don't know what those will be like yet.

Meanwhile DRK only has a 10% HP shield that comes with a risk. It will however be able to be used on tank busters without risk. Nonetheless, it's about on par with Intervention. That being said, if we wanna be real here, PLD's Intervention is going to be OP as hell for v1.0.

WAR has literally zero utility.

[SunAurel]

the utility is pretty much useless and just a drop on a hot stone. divine veil has a fairly long cd and you will always have a healer with you that can shield anyway, and an extra shield on a topped-of party is worth nothing

Intervention eats up half our oath gauge which still builds fairly slow in shield oathand we need to sacrifice rampart or sentinel to make it actually worth something, + it's only reliably usefull if you are the ot because as mt, you'll most likely not have designated intervention target

the raids are designed to be cleared without this utility, so it really is optional and therefore, the best way to support your group is survive - which all tanks can do - and dish out damage, which other tanks can do better with next tuesday

as i said before, pld needs damage utility that is not tied to their direct damage output bu via a group buff that pushes the party's dps so they can make up for the deficit the pld brings to the party because group mitigation tools lose their effect the better gear you have and the more used you are to the content

you will only need a pld if:
A) Your healers are shit
B) Your raid group is undergeared
C) Your raid group is composed of idiots

Susi and Lak are not really dififcult but you can see it here as well. In the first 5 runs I had to shield Ukehi with PoA or DV, but after that our healers adjusted and it was unnecessary to do so, therefore my non-dmg based utility went out of the window

[SunSand]

but why couldn't it be Warrior for once :<

Dont know if you were there for 2.0. And I mean after the buff cuz the stigma sticks. Kinda like after Pld was buffed in 3.x the stigma stuck. Yes it was still "the worst" but it was no longer a straight up failure.

Anyways, it doesnt matter if your talking about the highest play which is fighting for world first or speedkills. Screw talking about those people cuz theyll switch to whichever gets it done the best no matter how small the buff is because thats how you play those types. Class balance only matters for that type in which gives the biggest benefits for next to all the players who attempt those in that style. Lets talk about us, the people who will try our hardest even though we aint gonna get WF. We dont know how big the damage gaps will be, prolly back like HW(NO calm down not that big) with War in lead (how they change shake it off will affect everything), and Drk being just slightly ahead of Pld not by that much. Pld will still be amazing for "midcore" or whatever you call people behind the others(no not the wait till echo or tons of guides). Saying their utility will be useless is a large understatement because they wont even be able to do the whole fights in dps mode after seeing it once like the others. The people who still try to play as optimal as they can will prolly lean on the utility even after more than a few kills(especially if you get shafted on gear alot). And for the record, even with full vit I dont see Drks TBN being amazing as an OT ability, if a single person is being targeted and is half healthish whats your 5k shield gonna do versus A.Benefic,Adlo, and even tetra/swift/presence cure 2+lolbenison.