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  1. #1
    Player
    Maeka's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Posts
    1,281
    Character
    Maeka Blazewing
    World
    Cactuar
    Main Class
    Gladiator Lv 90
    Quote Originally Posted by Rawrz View Post
    Good healers will always push DPS. If the rate of damage is slow, sure Ill let you hit 20
    This is just asking for trouble.

    I dunno about other tanks, but I HATE this with a purple passion.

    Your #1 job is to HEAL. IF you have EXTRA time, THEN you can throw out a little DPS. Letting me go way down to 20% wondering if I'm going to get an incoming heal or not is not doing your job whatsoever, especially not in Stormblood content where you can have random bouts of 30%+ HP damage, especially on those larger pulls that everybody is bugging me to do.

    Sometimes I might not see that stupid AoE marker because of all the mobs piled up ontop of it. Sometimes I have a split second lag that causes me to eat something that on my screen it looks like I was well outside the range of before the mob was finished casting.

    If anything like this happens when I am 20%, I am dead plain and simple and you would have failed your job as a healer.

    And what if lag happens and your heal doesn't get off as soon as you would like and you're a second too late? I've seen incoming heals when I was 500-1k HP (as a 41k+ tank!) in some Stormblood dungeons. I'm like "Hello? Heal?" and a split second before I drop dead, I get healed..... barely enough to take the next hit. Then the healer has to spam heals to get me back up to at least half and I end up spamming Clemency because I do NOT like being that low.

    But if I'm spamming Clemency, that means less MP for Flash or Holy Spirit, that means I can't use Requiescat for extra DPS (because that is reliant upon MP) and it just causes all sorts of problems.

    And, not to mention, heal-bombing the tank is a lot of spike threat instead of applying that threat gradually by keeping the tank in the 50-75% range like you're supposed to. It just isn't a good idea.

    As a healer, I would never do this whatsoever. Yes, I put out less damage, but tanks never have to feel nervous when I'm healing, and to be honest, the runs aren't THAT much slower if I keep a tank 50-75%.

    EDIT: BTW, I get a LOT of commendations when I play Healer. I guess this might be why...
    (7)
    Last edited by Maeka; 07-14-2017 at 02:20 PM.

  2. #2
    Player
    Shurrikhan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Posts
    12,849
    Character
    Tani Shirai
    World
    Cactuar
    Main Class
    Monk Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Maeka View Post
    This is just asking for trouble.

    I dunno about other tanks, but I HATE this with a purple passion.

    Your #1 job is to HEAL. IF you have EXTRA time, THEN you can throw out a little DPS.
    They clearly have extra time. For any GCD in which not healing us won't let you us, they technically have extra time. That doesn't mean they should wait and Cure II when they could have used Regen earlier in order to heal more DPS overall, but... I really would have hoped this was more obvious.

    Yes, latency and tank screw-ups, rotational or worse, are worthwhile considerations. But so long as they're being factored in, and not actually forcing nonoptimal CD usage, alive is alive.
    (0)

  3. #3
    Player
    Maeka's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Posts
    1,281
    Character
    Maeka Blazewing
    World
    Cactuar
    Main Class
    Gladiator Lv 90
    Quote Originally Posted by Shurrikhan View Post
    They clearly have extra time. For any GCD in which not healing us won't let you us, they technically have extra time. That doesn't mean they should wait and Cure II when they could have used Regen earlier in order to heal more DPS overall, but... I really would have hoped this was more obvious.
    They clearly DON'T have extra time if I'm hitting 500-1000 HP left on 41k+ before the heal lands. This means they are BARELY keeping ahead of the damage, and sorry but I don't know some RandomHealer393482 well enough to trust that I will actually get the heal in time.

    So, I end up spamming more Clemency which kills my threat output because I don't trust the healer, because he is NOT keeping me comfortably healed. I don't care about Healer DPS. Sorry, I don't. The Healer could keep me 100% at all times and not throw a single Stone and I would be happier than almost dying on every pull.

    Now obviously some middle-ground would be nice. An Aero III or some Stone going on near the end of the pull when the incoming damage has tapered off, sure. But I don't like feeling tempted to blow Hallowed Ground because some Healer doesn't look like he can hack the content because I keep dropping way down in health constantly.

    Maybe the healer is "good" (I use this term loosely) enough to know exactly when to throw the heal, but I don't know him or trust him enough with that. Sorry, I don't.

    EDIT: And I'm starting to really hate seeing SCHs in my groups. They keep wanting to DPS, but after as many nerfs as that class has gotten, and the fact that they can barely keep you alive even when they aren't DPSing... I get nervous seeing that dreaded symbol appear on my 4mans. I find myself going "whm please...." before I see the group composition. The SCHs that try to DPS are even worse... a couple groups I've felt tempted to abandon duty because I nearly drop dead every other pull and their DPS ain't even all that great anyways. I'd rather they would spend more time keeping me alive than trying to act like a 3rd DPS. No offense to the good SCHs out there, I feel for you guys, your class was nerfed to oblivion... but if you simply must play SCH... then be a bit more careful, please.
    (3)
    Last edited by Maeka; 07-14-2017 at 02:31 PM.

  4. #4
    Player
    aleph_null's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2016
    Posts
    690
    Character
    Aleph Alpha
    World
    Tonberry
    Main Class
    Warrior Lv 80
    Quote Originally Posted by Maeka View Post
    This means they are BARELY keeping ahead of the damage, and sorry but I don't know some RandomHealer393482 well enough to trust that I will actually get the heal in time.
    Probably RandomHealer393482 doesn't care whether RandomTank284393 trusts them either. If people are dying then yeah they misjudged their capacity, if people are alive they're doing their job fine.
    (2)

  5. #5
    Player
    Maeka's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Posts
    1,281
    Character
    Maeka Blazewing
    World
    Cactuar
    Main Class
    Gladiator Lv 90
    Quote Originally Posted by aleph_null View Post
    Probably RandomHealer393482 doesn't care whether RandomTank284393 trusts them either. If people are dying then yeah they misjudged their capacity, if people are alive they're doing their job fine.
    Well, see, if say a PLD is popping Clemency constantly because they don't trust their healer... then the damage lost from missed Requiescats, Holy Spirits, and having to spam Riot Blade to get MP back faster is greater than the damage lost from healing a bit more. They are actually making the dungeon slower when they create a situation in which the tank doesn't trust their healer.

    Tank and Healer make a team, and this team functions far better when they trust each other. Sure, they can just go lone wolf towards each other, but that's not productive for anybody in the group. When I'm treating the thing as if I'm trying to solo heal myself, I'm wasting a LOT of DPS output doing it. But yet that's exactly what I'm going to do if I don't trust the random healer I got in my group, because my job is to keep mobs off of other people and also to stay alive while doing it. If I don't trust the healer to keep me alive, then I'm going to do everything in my power to keep myself alive, regardless of my DPS output (or lack thereof).
    (2)