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  1. #1
    Player
    Shurrikhan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Posts
    12,995
    Character
    Tani Shirai
    World
    Cactuar
    Main Class
    Monk Lv 100
    You'll gradually figure out the conventions to it all. Chances are they're tracking your CDs or expecting you to deploy them in certain timings sensible for the dungeon. I suggest you learn how to track theirs as well. Look up their cooldowns, know what they look like, start thinking about the pulls necessary for it to recharge. If they have Benediction, for instance, they'll let you plummet, and will expect you to pop Convalescence at the very end of this health, as they'll probably follow up the drop with a HoT and go back to DPSing for another 15s or so. As a WHM have no other means of meaningful contribution after a single global of Aero III, most WHM would prefer you hold Hallowed Ground until after Holy mitigation, as not to waste it, if they can keep you safe in the interim anyways (e.g. if running with you). If you pop Living Dead, they may refuse to HoT for fear of it ticking just enough to prevent Walking Dead over Living Dead's duration, causing it to fade and the next auto-attack to really kill you. A WHM will wait until the last second of Walking Dead to Benediction you (or rather, the second to last, so that it has a chance to hit somewhere within the last, given its ridiculous delay).

    Healers may Regen both themselves and then you during a pull in order to shave a GCD off the actual fight. They may expect you to hold onto Blood Price for 6 seconds while they mass-stun for brief 100% mitigation, which means they'll expect you to regen your mana or TP pre-pull in order to deal AoE enmity before they're murdered after the stuns let up. Yes, that means dropping Darkside out of combat. Yes, that means making use of Deliverance-Equilibrium and/or preparing 50 Defiance gauge for Steel Cyclone, preferably with a lingering Storm's Eye. If you Requiescat when out of TP, a WHM or AST will expect you to self-heal while they AoE. After all, you can do so more efficiently than they can, and you have no other significant means of contribution.

    The main thing is not to panic when the healer seems to be in control despite how low he's letting you drop; you may well consume a CD that he is actually counting on later, thereby causing an actual panic situation later, especially if DPS falls below expectation.

    Healing/tanking in trash generally has far more to do with CDs (oGCD healing, your percentile mitigation, and burst AoE) than outright (especially on the GCD) HPS.


    NOTE: So far the only times I have died or let die from DPSing are when...
    a) I cleaved the healer, interrupting him.
    b) The tank cleaved me, interrupting me.
    c) an attack too strong to heal through without interruption targeted the healer and s/he had to move while I happened to take multiple crits.
    d) an attack too strong to heal through without interruption targeted the me and I had to move while the tank happened to take multiple crits.
    e) I forgot to turn Regen off when only pulling 3 packs at once of Doma Castle, so that I didn't actually "die" during Living Dead, but half a second afterwards.
    f) I used Regen unnecessarily on a tank pulling the double soldier (+Reaper) packs in Doma Castle, keeping him from activating Walking Dead. He died shortly after while I expected he would be in his health-capped period.
    g) Tried to Benediction the tank while he was d/cing, using it cautiously early due to my own lag spikes. 2 seconds later Walking Dead faded. Then it went off on his corpse.
    (1)
    Last edited by Shurrikhan; 07-14-2017 at 01:53 PM.

  2. #2
    Player
    Toothie-Cat's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2017
    Posts
    9
    Character
    Toothie Cat
    World
    Tonberry
    Main Class
    Dark Knight Lv 70
    i paired up with this kind healers, i died a few times, the thing is its not our fault... i got my CD and LD on cooldown, they dont heal you until you drop to 10% or they are really busy with spamming holy or no mana at all, the bottom line they are not doing there job at all.

    let them be, its not our fault...
    (1)

  3. #3
    Player
    Galgarion's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2014
    Posts
    612
    Character
    Famine Cruor
    World
    Mateus
    Main Class
    Marauder Lv 70
    The OP is why I'm switching over to Paladin
    (2)

  4. #4
    Player
    Galgarion's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2014
    Posts
    612
    Character
    Famine Cruor
    World
    Mateus
    Main Class
    Marauder Lv 70
    Can't edit on mobile? That's dumb. Anyway, ever since bloodbath + vengeance combo was taken away, I feel like I've lost too much control my damage recovery. Paladin self healing is too strong to ignore.
    (0)

  5. #5
    Player
    Maeka's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Posts
    1,281
    Character
    Maeka Blazewing
    World
    Cactuar
    Main Class
    Gladiator Lv 90
    Quote Originally Posted by Galgarion View Post
    Can't edit on mobile? That's dumb. Anyway, ever since bloodbath + vengeance combo was taken away, I feel like I've lost too much control my damage recovery. Paladin self healing is too strong to ignore.
    With the way mobs hit in Castrum Abania and beyond... trust me, even Clemency isn't all that powerful unless it crits. I can heal myself for 9k HP. I have ~42k. Big whoop. Special attacks from bosses do 10-15k quite regularly, and some do even more than that, and these are unavoidable.

    About the last boss of Castrum Abania, you start to discover that you are NOT as invincible as you used to think you were. I mean sure, in some place like Shisui, or even Doma Castle, that Clemency spell is sweet indeed... but it falls off rather quickly.
    (4)

  6. #6
    Player
    Lannybaby's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2017
    Posts
    123
    Character
    Lann Devereux
    World
    Exodus
    Main Class
    Warrior Lv 97
    I was told by a friend to put an index card on my monitor to block the hp bar, but only around the halfway point so I still have an idea as to when to use def cds. I did this in an expert and I was panicking a lot in the inside whenever my hp dropped below 50% because I couldn't see exactly how much I had left. I'm not sure what my friend had in mind when she suggested this, but I died twice in that dungeon (temple of the fist). On the first death, the healer (sch) said it was due to lag on his end and the second death was because he forgot he didn't have any aetherflow when he was trying to spam lustrate.

    Needless to say, I was very irritated.
    (1)

  7. #7
    Player
    Exiled_Tonberry's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2015
    Posts
    1,660
    Character
    Sharl Llyntine
    World
    Jenova
    Main Class
    White Mage Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by fumofu View Post
    I absolutely hate this kind of healers who tries to 'push dps' at expense of more healing. Good healer is the one who keeps me alive and don't make me feel like I could die at any moment. Healer dps isn't really such a big deal. Now, if healer dps and:
    1) any dd dies - now that's a big dps loss.
    2) tank dies - possible wipe
    I'd say big risk for... little bit of extra dps healer provides?
    I'd rather have healer just heal and throw dps once in a while when it's really safe than recklessly pushing his dps and risking failing his job which is... KEEPING PARTY ALIVE!
    You clearly have no idea what a good healer can do for your party.
    It's not uncommon for healers to outdps others in AOE damage. Why spam heals at you just to make you feel more comfortable and slow down the run by minutes?
    (2)

  8. #8
    Player
    winsock's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2014
    Posts
    788
    Character
    Chaosgrimm Winsock
    World
    Adamantoise
    Main Class
    Conjurer Lv 60
    Quote Originally Posted by Exiled_Tonberry View Post
    You clearly have no idea what a good healer can do for your party.
    It's not uncommon for healers to outdps others in AOE damage. Why spam heals at you just to make you feel more comfortable and slow down the run by minutes?
    Because:
    1) a tank can kite to lower dmg and ultimately prevent a wipe... but will typically lower the outgoing DPS as well. You want to prevent the tank from deciding to kite
    2) the overwhelming majority of the time, you can keep the tank at higher than a thread of hp, without impacting your DPS because you no longer need to be in cleric. There is no difference in HPS or DPS between [Holy, Holy, Cure II, Cure II, repeat] and [Holy, cure II, Holy, cure II, repeat] for example.
    (0)

  9. #9
    Player
    Rawrz's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2015
    Posts
    1,704
    Character
    Sir Rawrz
    World
    Gilgamesh
    Main Class
    Red Mage Lv 90
    Quote Originally Posted by winsock View Post
    Because:
    1) a tank can kite to lower dmg and ultimately prevent a wipe... but will typically lower the outgoing DPS as well. You want to prevent the tank from deciding to kite
    2) the overwhelming majority of the time, you can keep the tank at higher than a thread of hp, without impacting your DPS because you no longer need to be in cleric. There is no difference in HPS or DPS between [Holy, Holy, Cure II, Cure II, repeat] and [Holy, cure II, Holy, cure II, repeat] for example.
    The only downside to this is with the the loss of aero/bio/Combust weave opportunities have grown scarce. I really want to largesse and cast a heal but i need to wait until x amount of time to clip/reapply my dot or its a dps loss. Hang on tankb your buffed heal and ogcd is on its way.
    (0)

  10. #10
    Player
    Maeka's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Posts
    1,281
    Character
    Maeka Blazewing
    World
    Cactuar
    Main Class
    Gladiator Lv 90
    Quote Originally Posted by Rawrz View Post
    The only downside to this is with the the loss of aero/bio/Combust weave opportunities have grown scarce. I really want to largesse and cast a heal but i need to wait until x amount of time to clip/reapply my dot or its a dps loss. Hang on tankb your buffed heal and ogcd is on its way.
    Seriously, you're worried about clipping Aero buffs that you want to wait to heal the tank?

    *sigh* That one or two ticks of Aero is... what a couple hundred damage? That is NOT going to make the dungeon any shorter whatsoever... meanwhile, the tank decides that he's too low and decides to pop a Clemency which then prevents him from using Requiscat sooner which is far more damaging than a tick or two of Aero.
    (4)

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