Lets stop fighting SE and work with them. What are your ideas?

[Deceptus]

No one is "fighting" with the SE developers.

We are merely reacting to the abilities and modifiers that we have absolutely zero control over.

[AlexSag]

I don't think you can get many of the tanks in the community to participate in something like this because there are many tanks hate the idea of having their DPS decreased. I think for some, the interesting part of tanking is getting maximum DPS output while surviving the fight. Anything done that decreases that amount will be a turn off for them. If SE is going this way, they likely will alienate a lot of tank players. Thought I suppose locking tanks into a specific play style will do that.

[Inuakurei]

I don't think you can get many of the tanks in the community to participate in something like this because there are many tanks hate the idea of having their DPS decreased. I think for some, the interesting part of tanking is getting maximum DPS output while surviving the fight. Anything done that decreases that amount will be a turn off for them. If SE is going this way, they likely will alienate a lot of tank players. Thought I suppose locking tanks into a specific play style will do that.

Yeah I'm getting that feeling too. After going through the "Why do you tank?" thread I noticed that a large amount of the answers are along the lines of "I like the short queue times" or "no one in my fc wants to tank, so I will". Which tells me a lot of tanks don't actually want to tank, they want to dps; but an overabundance of dps players, queue times, and necessity pull them over to the tank role.

[HoodRat]

Can we stop with the whole pure tank thing? Any good tank that knows what they're doing can focus on dps while still performing the same roles as a "pure tank." That's why some people are saying that playing a "pure tank" is bad, you're doing the exact same thing just with much less dps.

[Inuakurei]

Can we stop with the whole pure tank thing? Any good tank that knows what they're doing can focus on dps while still performing the same roles as a "pure tank." That's why some people are saying that playing a "pure tank" is bad, you're doing the exact same thing just with much less dps.

You're completely correct, and that's part of the issue. "Pure tank" is so easy, that any competent tank can both "pure tank" and dps at the same time. If thats what SE wanted tanks in FFXIV to be (and it seemed like it was) then fine, thats cool. But recent events suggest they want to change that. It seems like they want us to use tank stance and "pure tank" while tanking.

I just want us to come up with ideas that would make both us and SE happy. I fear that if we don't they'll just take away our str, add tenacity, and thats it. We might be forced into the "pure tank" playstyle with no changes to make "pure tank" fun because we were too busy resisting a change that they've already made their mind up on. That's my fear.

[Falar]

There is no fighting really, they do what they want.

If they keep screwing up tanks, I'm out. Simple as that. For me, this expansion is terrible. My favorite class is Dark Knight, and this is what they took:

A lot of attack power
Shadowskin
Delirum
Reprisal
Low Blow
Dark Dance
Blood Price giving MP
Dark Passenger being worth using
Unleash being worth using
Scourge
Less healing on Soule Eater

And in return they gave us Bloodspiller, The Blackest Night, and Quietus and more MP return in Grit on Syphon Strike.

[HoodRat]

I can't think of any way they can without doing a massive rework of tanking. At this point, it seems they have two options: deny tanks access to the attributes they need to do high dps, or increase the difficulty of tanking to where we actually need to use vit and can't sit in dps stance the entire time. With the former, the more experienced players are screwed over; and with the latter, the less experienced players are screwed over. Either way, someone is getting screwed over. And if they do rework tanks, like someone else said, it'll take a large amount of work and time so it won't be happening anytime soon.

[YitharV2]

You're completely correct, and that's part of the issue. "Pure tank" is so easy, that any competent tank can both "pure tank" and dps at the same time. If thats what SE wanted tanks in FFXIV to be (and it seemed like it was) then fine, thats cool. But recent events suggest they want to change that. It seems like they want us to use tank stance and "pure tank" while tanking.

I just want us to come up with ideas that would make both us and SE happy. I fear that if we don't they'll just take away our str, add tenacity, and thats it. We might be forced into the "pure tank" playstyle with no changes to make "pure tank" fun because we were too busy resisting a change that they've already made their mind up on. That's my fear.

I personally think active mitigation and constant damage WoW has would be fun.
http://wow.gamepedia.com/Active_Mitigation
http://www.wowhead.com/spell=2565/shield-block
http://www.wowhead.com/spell=190456/ignore-pain

The problem is I think that would clash with SE's desire for tanking to be easy for newcomers.

As HoodRat stated, it would need a massive rework of tanking.

[shao32]

I pretty much agree with all of you. The big issue is that pure tanking is not very engaging and the only engaging part about tanking is when we are optimizing dps.

The only solution to have SE and the player base happy i think its just remove the tank stance damage penalty, allowing us to keep the DPS and being tanky at the same time.

But idk why its not a popular idea over here.

[Remiilia-vermilion]

The only solution to have SE and the player base happy i think its just remove the tank stance damage penalty, allowing us to keep the DPS and being tanky at the same time.

But idk why its not a popular idea over here.

How would that work with WAR though? Unless they're adding the same effects of defiance to deliverance