If you leveled Conjurer expecting to be a black mage type character.. Can you swap?

[Holland]

Pretty much, If they leave the lore as it is, then CNJ getting WHM would make no bloody sense. For one, they would lose Elemental spells, the very things that define what a CNJ is. Oh, and they are probably going to have to change the cities that you find their guilds in since, why would THMs who are now the elementalists live in a desert and not in the forest where the power of the elementals are greater?

It makes sense when the main job of the Conjurers in Gridania is the balance and peace with the spiritual beings of Eorzea, that they are named "Elementals" is of no relevance. They granted CNJ the most powerful revive spell the game has to offer at 50, if that didn't provide some hindsight as to who is WHM then.. I don't know what else...

[Oscillate_Wildly]

Pretty much, If they leave the lore as it is, then CNJ getting WHM would make no bloody sense. For one, they would lose Elemental spells, the very things that define what a CNJ is. Oh, and they are probably going to have to change the cities that you find their guilds in since, why would THMs who are now the elementalists live in a desert and not in the forest where the power of the elementals are greater?

Again, jobs are not classes though. They're an extension of the class itself. White mage could work for Conjurer, since conjurers already have all the necessary base skills such as for healing just like how thaumaturges have dark magic necessary for black mage.

Although you could argue that because thaumaturge has banish and light magic, then they'd lose those as well. I'm happy with the choice they've made, and I don't think that elemental spells are what makes a black mage a black mage. I know it's what's the word....vintage? old school? Original-FF? However life goes on and these spells can be managed without taking them away from Conjurers.

Like renaming one set of offensive spells (either for conjurer or black mage) and giving the black mage's version more power and oomf.

[Bowen]

Again, jobs are not classes though. They're an extension of the class itself. White mage could work for Conjurer, since conjurers already have all the necessary base skills such as for healing just like how thaumaturges have dark magic necessary for black mage.

Although you could argue that because thaumaturge has banish and light magic, then they'd lose those as well. I'm happy with the choice they've made, and I don't think that elemental spells are what makes a black mage a black mage. I know it's what's the word....vintage? old school? Original-FF? However life goes on and these spells can be managed without taking them away from Conjurers.

Like renaming one set of offensive spells (either for conjurer or black mage) and giving the black mage's version more power and oomf.

But, what I am saying is since they are moving the spells around and if THM gets the elemental spells, then they would have to switch the area they come from because why would THM who have elemental spells and worship the elementals live in the desert (Thanalan) where the elementals have really no affect when they could be in the forest (Black Shroud) where the elementals are strong?
So Imma go to bed now cause it is two in the morning and I have to wake up for school in four hours. Buh Bye!

[Focant]

But, what I am saying is since they are moving the spells around and if THM gets the elemental spells, then they would have to switch the area they come from because why would THM who have elemental spells and worship the elementals live in the desert (Thanalan) where the elementals have really no affect when they could be in the forest (Black Shroud) where the elementals are strong?
So Imma go to bed now cause it is two in the morning and I have to wake up for school in four hours. Buh Bye!

That's working under the assumption they actually move the elemental spells to THM. As Oscillate pointed out though, BLM isn't THM, it's an extension of it. THM itself doesn't need to receive powerful nukes, only BLM does. Also, while it's more traditional for BLM to have elemental nukes (I think anyways, I actually don't remember much from older FFs), there's no reason they can't just use dark and arcane magic to deal damage.

[Oscillate_Wildly]

But, what I am saying is since they are moving the spells around and if THM gets the elemental spells, then they would have to switch the area they come from because why would THM who have elemental spells and worship the elementals live in the desert (Thanalan) where the elementals have really no affect when they could be in the forest (Black Shroud) where the elementals are strong?

There's no guarantee they're moving spells around and they shouldn't have to as I've said that black mages are not exclusively tied to elemental magic, but if it was translated somewhere that we're getting a full switch, then I'd like to see a link to this information?
As someone has said before, they can give Black Mages native BM spells that do similar elemental damage but perhaps call them something else.

As these are jobs with specific Job related spells, there's no reason to mess with the base class. That's not what Jobs are out to do and it's an entirely ridiculous and huge waste of time and resources to do so. Especially as it's arguing in theory that Jobs are going to replace classes themselves which isn't true at all. They are simply a different or extended way to play that specific discipline.

So I'm saying don't bet on full swap of skill sets and storylines to suit Jobs. I would expect them to handle this better by giving black mages access to various forms of dark arts, like Arcane magic. They already have access to a few of those spells now such as Gravity and Drain which are also related to the black mage. You could also make certain spells like Regen AoE through use of blood magic much like how sacrifice works.

[Bowen]

There's no guarantee they're moving spells around and they shouldn't have to as I've said that black mages are not exclusively tied to elemental magic, but if it was translated somewhere that we're getting a full switch, then I'd like to see a link to this information?
As someone has said before, they can give Black Mages native BM spells that do similar elemental damage but perhaps call them something else.

As these are jobs with specific Job related spells, there's no reason to mess with the base class. That's not what Jobs are out to do and it's an entirely ridiculous and huge waste of time and resources to do so. Especially as it's arguing in theory that Jobs are going to replace classes themselves which isn't true at all. They are simply a different or extended way to play that specific discipline.

So I'm saying don't bet on full swap of skill sets and storylines to suit Jobs. I would expect them to handle this better by giving black mages access to various forms of dark arts, like Arcane magic. They already have access to a few of those spells now such as Gravity and Drain which are also related to the black mage. You could also make certain spells like Regen AoE through use of blood magic much like how sacrifice works.

Yeah, I see what you mean, (*Sigh*) Oh well better get to leveling THM tomorrow. . . Oh wait I can't because the game keeps crashing every five minutes. TT>TT

[Oscillate_Wildly]

You should still be able to use Conjurer to deal damage though. I don't know why everyone is feeling bad about this. ): Jobs aren't the end to everything and are only one of the ways in which to play the game. Jobs are very...centric. But they shouldn't unbalance the game to make them absolutely necessary in every single situation, and I hope that they don't. :S

[Teakwood]

Basically, assuming that jobs have to evolve naturally out of their classes lorewise assumes that the "protect everyone and save Eorzea" job, Paladin, evolves naturally from "A PIRATE DOES WHAT A PIRATE WANTS, YARRR" and "paid to fight bloody duels to the death in a sandy pit for the entertainment of rich, amoral Lalafell".

It's more like "you already have a particular skill set, this makes you a prime candidate to learn something else in-character that builds off of that skill set but isn't particularly related to that skill set's story".

[Bowen]

You should still be able to use Conjurer to deal damage though. I don't know why everyone is feeling bad about this. ): Jobs aren't the end to everything and are only one of the ways in which to play the game. Jobs are very...centric. But they shouldn't unbalance the game to make them absolutely necessary in every single situation, and I hope that they don't. :S

Wha? CNJ can actually deal dmg? Since when? O_o I do Toto runs all the time as CNJ and always try to Nuke stuff (Yes, I used all my buffs {Profundity etc. . .} and things before hand I even made sure that Banish stuck so that Fire, Aero, and Thunder spells could become more powerful even if only a tiny bit)

[Bowen]

Basically, assuming that jobs have to evolve naturally out of their classes lorewise assumes that the "protect everyone and save Eorzea" job, Paladin, evolves naturally from "A PIRATE DOES WHAT A PIRATE WANTS, YARRR" and "paid to fight bloody duels to the death in a sandy pit for the entertainment of rich, amoral Lalafell".

It's more like "you already have a particular skill set, this makes you a prime candidate to learn something else in-character that builds off of that skill set but isn't particularly related to that skill set's story".

I can't even justify why GLA and MRD = PLD. . . In any way