Current EX Difficulty is a Correct Business Decision by SE

[Alistaire]

Hardcores: $15 mil in sub revenue + (200k * 40 ) = $23 mil

Mass Appeal: $12 mil in sub revenue + (800k * 40) = $12 mil + $32 mil (!) in X-Pac revenue = $44 mil.

Why in the world would you show x-pac revenue for one side but not both? Can you be so hardcore you don't need to buy the expansion? If showing numbers always proved your point nobody'd ever fail a math test.

[Atmora]

I love these "Raiders need to stop thinking they're the only players, making content easier is objectively correct from a business standpoint to appeal to the players who REALLY pay their bills." posts because they never take into account that you have to appeal to the casual, midcore and hardcore player base. Perceptions of the game always leak down from the most hardcore players and no matter how irrelevant it is to the lower level player base it always colors their view of the game and the issues it has; I see people complaining all the time that the game is to easy despite them being actual garbage at it. This also influences how satisfied the players as a whole are and colors the word of mouth that spreads outside the game, encouraging or discouraging new players. Square needs to appeal to a large group of different players, THAT'S WHAT MAKES RUNNING AN MMO SO HARD. There is no "They need to chill out and realize that they're not who pays Square's bills." We all pay Square's bills and we all matter, the sooner everyone gets that through their head the better.

[TankHunter678]

Basically SE needs good ramp up in difficulty, and good ramp down.

Royal Menagerie was the climax of the main SB story, as anyone knows after the climax you have a drop as things wind down.

In this case, the current ex primals are a wind down from Royal Menagerie. However the next sets of primals will begin ramping up.

That being said, I found the current batch of ex primals to be very technical. If you do the dance right they are not difficult. Do the dance wrong and they can punish you hard.

[akaneakki]

The extremes are just there for data. If the clear rate is too simple they will mostlikely ramp up the diffuculty.

[Lavarinth]

First time I've gone in without wiping to both Extremes. I spent months clearing Savage on Alex, and I enjoyed the struggle. Normal is for people who just want to enjoy the game, and I have a blast with them as well. Extreme/Savage is for people who want an extra challenge and aren't required for OP's enjoyment. They drop gear for progressing in Extreme/Savage content, something OP clearly doesn't enjoy and rather it be geared more towards "Casuals". You don't need Extreme/Savage gear for your Normal or dungeon runs. I feel a sense of pride knowing I cleared them and would be upset and bored if this was the future of Extreme. Square isn't required to give you access to all content just because you "pay their bills" while we, apparently, contribute nothing. We got a secret cutscene in Coil and "Casuals" were upset to not get the ability to experience it, so they gave them a Normal mode of raids, that should have been the end of players asking for easier content from the Extreme content.

[Dzian]

The self-proclaimed "top 10%" or hardcores need to understand the basic economics of sub-based vs F2p: Sub is all about quantity because an "expert's" $15 is worth the same as the sub of a noob, also $15.

Hardcores: $15 mil in sub revenue + (200k * 40 ) = $23 mil

Mass Appeal: $12 mil in sub revenue + (800k * 40) = $12 mil + $32 mil (!) in X-Pac revenue = $44 mil. .

The Major flaw with these types of threads is you completely fail to account for a vast amount of the playerbase...

You're only accounting 2 extremes. those top tier 10% hardcore players or so you dubbed them.

and the masses who apparently want everything easy moded. the way in which you have constructed your post suggests that they make up 90% of the player base and that's incredibly flawed..

I am neither in that top 10% self proclaimed hardcore god of the world. nor I am in what you label as the masses. the crowd that wants everything easy and want things like the royal menagerie nerfed because its so hard..

I'm in a third group that honestly thinks the menagerie was perhaps a little to easy if you look at it from a story point of view the amount of build up and tension and level of threat the story tries to create is no where near the level of challenge of the fight...

You might say I was pretty casual given that I only unlocked and cleared the menagerie last night. definitely not in that top 10% that would have probably done it even before early access was finished. I've just been working my way through at my own pace around work and other life commitments.. so not putting in the hours many players have. it's taken me 2 and a half weeks to finish the msq but that doesn't put me in the masses either. because in truth I found a lot of the story battles a little anti climatic because of there relative ease. including the menagerie.

Took me maybe 7 attempts to clear but maybe 2 to suss the mechanics because of how easy they really are.

Challenging content also feels more satisfying to complete. because it actually feels more like you've earnt that clear and reward. (scientifically it's a dopamine hit and they feel gooddddddd) stupid easy things don't feel anywhere near as satisfying or rewarding because you don't get that dopamine hit..

the msq battle to take valedina for example I honestly had to put my controller down and answer the door and came back to "duty complete" there was absolutely no satisfaction in that just a whole load of wtf??? the story made this out to be some impossible mission.....

if you want to keep players playing the needs to be rewarding and making everything easy does not make anything rewarding, and you'll end up losing more player to boredom than you would those who couldn't rise up to even a simple challenge like the menagerie..

[Shut]

Another economic example: SE could focus on making hardcore content to retain lets say, 200k subs at an average of 5 months each. Or SE could focus on mass appeal and get lets say, 800k subs for 1 month each. One might thing, "oh wow appealing to hardcores gets the equivalent of 1 million subs x $15, so $15 mil, that's greater than 800k x $15 (12 mil), so SE should appeal to hardcore players." WRONG! You would be forgetting one crucial detail: You must factor in sales of the expansion pack too! That's where it becomes clear that it makes more business sense to appeal to a wide audience rather than "hardcores." When you factor in X-pac purchases at, lets say, $40 each, the math becomes as follows:

Hardcores: $15 mil in sub revenue + (200k * 40 ) = $23 mil

Mass Appeal: $12 mil in sub revenue + (800k * 40) = $12 mil + $32 mil (!) in X-Pac revenue = $44 mil.

You're not good either, what I see in your argument is that hardcore represent a huge amount of money. I'll add this:
$23m + $44m = $67m
+/- 50% than if they stuck with only a casual base. SE being businessmen, they know where their interest are if they create content for every kind of players

As Dzian said: you fail at understanding what player base is if you keep being stuck into the hardcore vs casual mentality.
Gordias and Midas raids didn't destroyed the casual part of the community of FFXIV, but a vast part of players with variety of skills level between the most hardcores and those playing the game casualy. Harder contents drag a wider portion of the community than 10%.

I don't remember mass unsubbings during 1st and second coil either, despite T5 being hard as fuck/bugged (iirc) and was undoable for weeks, and T9 being around the lvl of A8S (mostly under but not that far, people are the only judges).

[Uriel_Kross]

Here is my concern on the extreme fights and why I feel they will be nerfed. It took me a week to finally clear. Susano we kept wiping either due to lack of dps and enrage or people unable to do the simple mechanics. Once I did clear and joined a farm party I realized there is a huge skill gap between the clear and farm parties. Yes the fights are easy but due to number of new people using boost pots who have never done an ex or even 24 man raid most groups appear to be struggling to get through.

[Anzaman]

Why in the world would you show x-pac revenue for one side but not both? Can you be so hardcore you don't need to buy the expansion?

Yes, all hardcore players got free expansion.

[akaneakki]

I actually laugh at people who say extreme primals are hardcore content lmao. Honestly they are all easy and if a grup with 6-7 ppl can do it, so can 8 (easily) but then again, it's the players fault for not learning their class or propely play it. Then you have those players whi think it's okay they play bad and the rest should carry their weight, this is an big issue too.