Dam. meter

[akaneakki]

but the actual help does happen.

Some people just say they need help but wont even say they use a parser, unless they are open for it. I know a person who did bismarck with a NIN who did very low and ended up the NIN using a parser and practicted after we gave him the opener and rotations, what happened to him? One of the best NIN's on the server. This guy did actually take advice, unlike others, advice is harrasment lol.

[Seoulstar]

Some people just say they need help but wont even say they use a parser, unless they are open for it. I know a person who did bismarck with a NIN who did very low and ended up the NIN using a parser and practicted after we gave him the opener and rotations, what happened to him? One of the best NIN's on the server. This guy did actually take advice, unlike others, advice is harrasment lol.

I would not say advice is harassment. Because there are literally people who actually harass people while saying they are giving "advice". It depends solely on how you do it.

[akaneakki]

I would not say advice is harassment. Because there are literally people who actually harass people while saying they are giving "advice". It depends solely on how you do it.

''Hey, I see you cast stone 2, when there is 3 or more adds,its great you DPS, but holy helps and stuns the mobs and does aoe if you want to'' ''If you dont shut your mouth I will teach you how to play''
See? I have a screenshot somewhere too, and you know whats sad? People in this thread actually support that behavior, it's unreal. I don't even use a parser and I got told off like that? I find people like him exist more off, than actually ''pro parser elitist''. Might as well disable chat right?

Edit: Ahh yah, just in vault. People can't dodge the orbs and blames me aka the healer to regen and medica 2 spam, won't help when they keep being hit by the orbs on the wall. Just got dismissed and whos toxic? It's even worse when the bad players with or without a parser are more toxic than those who actually play good. Took screens on ps4 will upload them later.

[Sacred_Nym]

I do think the average player needs to be doing better than they are, but I honestly get the feeling that throwing a number into their face and telling them it's not high enough isn't going to do anything but demoralize.

If there's anything I've learned since I've started to play this game, it's that you can't motivate anyone to do anything without a clear, material incentive. If raids didn't give gear you'd probably have maybe 1/10th the people running them. If Ex Primals didn't give mounts, they'd be dead in a week. If 24-mans didn't give tomestone upgrades... you see what I'm getting at.

So I propose instead of trying to make people improve by harassment, we motivate them with rewards.

Basically at the end of a dungeon, we receive a report card that grades us on Damage done, Avoidable damage taken, Overhealing, Times lost aggro vs. # of enemies pulled, etc. filtered by role. Kind of like the results screen of an Action game like DMC or Bayonetta. This wouldn't even necessarily have to be hard numbers. Letter grades based on how much the instance itself might expect would be sufficient. And an overall grade of say... B+ or higher would net you a free, random piece of gear from the dungeon for your role, or bonus tomes, or extra tokens in the case of raid/Ex. Higher grades might lead to better rewards, maybe even choosing which piece of gear you want rather than leaving it up to chance. Even if you don't need anything that's still potential GC seals.

I firmly believe that without rewarding good play in this manner, we won't see an improvement. A parser isn't going to fix anything, but a carrot just might.

What do you guys think?

[akaneakki]

People actually support this behavior in this forum, I wont say who, but it's very obvious who they are. It's a simple chat, where a player says, holy on more than 3-4 adds, where he cast stone 2 instead even when hes lvl 60, then person tells him what holy does and can help with, then tells him to shut up. MmM And remember guys, this is a person obviously without a parser and also this behavior is way more seen than those ''pro parsers''. Might as well disable the chat then. And don't bother tell me to use premade, this is a online game after all, where team effort should be a thing and not 1 person being an a-hole about it.

I have a long list of screenshots like this, give me time and I will gladly post them in here. I see this on DAILY basis. Pfft.

[Ama_Hamada]

Some of my more favorite runs through mentor roulette have involved me giving rotation advice to people who need it and actually listen to the advice. If I see someone making a mistake there that can be easily fixed, I ask "xxx do you mind if I give you some advice", and try to help if they say yes. Hell, just Tuesday I helped a blm who was using fire3 followed by blizzard3 repeatedly in a dusk vigil, and by the end of it he was doing a decent rotation. The reason you may think people don't use parsers to help randoms in df is because you can't actually mention you're using a parser in chat, but the actual help does happen.

You do not need a praser to do that though, I do that all the time but I do not have one. My point is any reference from a praser leads to harassment, and this one time my 2 friends went in, confuses me. Those 2 where top dps, both of them 1 and 2 and they kinda go back and forth who is 1, and I know this via steam but ofc I can't say anything more then that. When the fight was done or they wipe, because something about metors being destroyed? I do not remember, but the group was trying to harass my 2 friends for not doing DPS, I think it was by some snippy AST who didn't know what cleric stance was. This AST was toxic was ef but was premade shielded from kicking. The ast was trying to claim he couldn't DPS because my 2 friends where not doing enough dps, or something, I got no idea been a while. So I guess sometimes people act like they have a praser but really don't?????????????????

I do think the average player needs to be doing better than they are, but I honestly get the feeling that throwing a number into their face and telling them it's not high enough isn't going to do anything but demoralize.

If there's anything I've learned since I've started to play this game, it's that you can't motivate anyone to do anything without a clear, material incentive. If raids didn't give gear you'd probably have maybe 1/10th the people running them. If Ex Primals didn't give mounts, they'd be dead in a week. If 24-mans didn't give tomestone upgrades... you see what I'm getting at.

So I propose instead of trying to make people improve by harassment, we motivate them with rewards.

Basically at the end of a dungeon, we receive a report card that grades us on Damage done, Avoidable damage taken, Overhealing, Times lost aggro vs. # of enemies pulled, etc. filtered by role. Kind of like the results screen of an Action game like DMC or Bayonetta. This wouldn't even necessarily have to be hard numbers. Letter grades based on how much the instance itself might expect would be sufficient. And an overall grade of say... B+ or higher would net you a free, random piece of gear from the dungeon for your role, or bonus tomes, or extra tokens in the case of raid/Ex. Higher grades might lead to better rewards, maybe even choosing which piece of gear you want rather than leaving it up to chance. Even if you don't need anything that's still potential GC seals.

I firmly believe that without rewarding good play in this manner, we won't see an improvement. A parser isn't going to fix anything, but a carrot just might.

What do you guys think?

I can support this

(edit for below, post count limitation is too limited)

No you don't, however the point of that person's post is that, people don't mention they even have a parser, they will tell them or eventually let them know then give them advice. If you look at his perspective, hes saying if people did have a parser, they would be aware of this by themselves. Many people straight out refuse they need to improve, look at the screenshot up there and the reply the person gets. Like I said, you don't need a parser to see if someone do wrong no, but then again, it's the basic stuff we talk about here, not the things you actually need to do. You can for example see a BLM cast fire 4 for a long time then suddenly drop his eniochian and she/he will cast fire 1 instead. This is basic, but it's the long term run where it gets more ''difficult'' and where people straight out refuse to actually understand what they are doing wrong. But then again, people here says you need to be using a parser to be an asshole, while my post proves otherwise .

So. You don't need to be a parser to be an asshole. I just think the issue is people are in denial or straight up doesn't give a damn what others say and it's all about the rest giving effort and as long that happens, that 1 person doesn't care. What if everyone in the group had same mindset as the lazy/denial player? You wont even see a clear. Be greatful for people who actually does good or tries really hard, without them you wouldn't even be that far. This is a message to people in general not you btw.

I fully agree>XD My argument is that it will provoke more toxicity then save compared to now if we did have official prasers. Also thanks for clearing that up, I am one of those that does the carrying (unless on SMN) I am still.. trying to get used to things.

(this will be my last post for a while, as inventory item issues are most important to me)

[akaneakki]

You do not need a praser to do that though, I do that all the time but I do not have one.

No you don't, however the point of that person's post is that, people don't mention they even have a parser, they will tell them or eventually let them know then give them advice. If you look at his perspective, hes saying if people did have a parser, they would be aware of this by themselves. Many people straight out refuse they need to improve, look at the screenshot up there and the reply the person gets. Like I said, you don't need a parser to see if someone do wrong no, but then again, it's the basic stuff we talk about here, not the things you actually need to do. You can for example see a BLM cast fire 4 for a long time then suddenly drop his eniochian and she/he will cast fire 1 instead. This is basic, but it's the long term run where it gets more ''difficult'' and where people straight out refuse to actually understand what they are doing wrong. But then again, people here says you need to be using a parser to be an asshole, while my post proves otherwise .

So. You don't need to be a parser to be an asshole. I just think the issue is people are in denial or straight up doesn't give a damn what others say and it's all about the rest giving effort and as long that happens, that 1 person doesn't care. What if everyone in the group had same mindset as the lazy/denial player? You wont even see a clear. Be greatful for people who actually does good or tries really hard, without them you wouldn't even be that far. This is a message to people in general not you btw.

[akaneakki]

...

I disagree. More people knowing how bad they are = they cant have a shit attitude towards others for helping. And besides with or without parser, harrasment is going to happen and if people do harras more with a official one, then they know they get a hard time. Harrasment with or without parser is still harrasment. Why can't people understand that devs/GM's already know people use parser but barely use it as a harrasment, because you know... its harrasment? I could tell someone they are blabla shit without one and still would be harrasment.

[bardaboo]

I do think the average player needs to be doing better than they are, but I honestly get the feeling that throwing a number into their face and telling them it's not high enough isn't going to do anything but demoralize.

If there's anything I've learned since I've started to play this game, it's that you can't motivate anyone to do anything without a clear, material incentive. If raids didn't give gear you'd probably have maybe 1/10th the people running them. If Ex Primals didn't give mounts, they'd be dead in a week. If 24-mans didn't give tomestone upgrades... you see what I'm getting at.

So I propose instead of trying to make people improve by harassment, we motivate them with rewards.

Basically at the end of a dungeon, we receive a report card that grades us on Damage done, Avoidable damage taken, Overhealing, Times lost aggro vs. # of enemies pulled, etc. filtered by role. Kind of like the results screen of an Action game like DMC or Bayonetta. This wouldn't even necessarily have to be hard numbers. Letter grades based on how much the instance itself might expect would be sufficient. And an overall grade of say... B+ or higher would net you a free, random piece of gear from the dungeon for your role, or bonus tomes, or extra tokens in the case of raid/Ex. Higher grades might lead to better rewards, maybe even choosing which piece of gear you want rather than leaving it up to chance. Even if you don't need anything that's still potential GC seals.

I firmly believe that without rewarding good play in this manner, we won't see an improvement. A parser isn't going to fix anything, but a carrot just might.

What do you guys think?

Rewards, ok i can get behind that, but we also need to seriously be ok with booting players at the opposite end. I can't count the amount of times I've been the "bad guy" for pointing out seriously poor play, and incorrect accessories, thus rewarding slackers, and by people that didn't even queue with that person. We see it on the forum too, "did you clear? Then who cares, so what if the run took a few minutes longer" Any reward system implemented would be undermined by white knights. A 4 hr cooldown on dungeon kicks? Cmon. This game punishes us for trying to punish slackers, thus rewarding slackers. Sure there are always going to be trolls and slackers, but there are too many people that are ok with it. Maybe if these white knights could see JUST HOW BAD THESE PEOPLE ARE they might be less inclined to vote no, less inclined to reward and carry.

[Yeol]

If you add a parser now, many people will be ashamed of their numbers. It will be discouraging for them to do duties.
Dev team is trying to lower the gap between players in Stromblood with battle system revamp. If it does work then the likelihood of having a parser in game will increase.

But adding it when the gab is huge is a big mistake. Those who use it regularly on daily basis know how bad the situation is..
All of a sudden .. parser shows MT as top dps. This will shock players who thought that they have been playing well all this time.

Adding such feature will make more damage than good when the gap is too large. But if the gap was small then they will see room for improvement.