As a healer, is it my job to DPS? A new perspective.

[Feyona]

I feel like you're missing my point, too.



No one, no matter what job they're playing is entitled to anything. You have to earn it in one way or another, whether it's pure skill, the indulgence of your teammates or friends, or cold hard cash.

And if you think "just anyone" can do it regardless of skill level I respectfully disagree.

Im not disagreeing with you, but in the context of healer dps which is what we are talking about I am obviousy able to do it without it. So the qualified to do it in that context doesnt really apply. I still feel apart from that if anyone works hard enough to get there they can, not just based on whether anyone else thinks they can. Groups are different anyone can have whoever they want in them true, but I wouldnt use the word non qualified to describe a non dps healer

[Lambdafish]

Im not disagreeing with you, but in the context of healer dps which is what we are talking about I am obviousy able to do it without it. So the qualified to do it in that context doesnt really apply. I still feel apart from that if anyone works hard enough to get there they can, not just based on whether anyone else thinks they can. Groups are different anyone can have whoever they want in them true, but I wouldnt use the word non qualified to describe a non dps healer

But some groups might want you to, that is their right, if you don't like that then find a group that better fits your requirements. That is my point.

Healer dps isnt necessary for me to be qualfied as a healer. I do that content without it. They way I took lambdafishes comment was that your not qualified to go in there if your not optimal in every way

Except that whether you can do it or not is irrelevant, because the party running savage sets the rules, and they are fully entitled to set whatever standard they like. If they want you to DPS then you should, if they struggle, have low gear and want you to heal extra, you also do that.

You called me elitist for having standards and giving people the freedom of expectation of skill in high-level content, in the same vein I should call you entitled for thinking everyone should bend to your needs rather than set their own group rules that you can easily walk away from. It's not nice, is it.

[bounddreamer]

Im not disagreeing with you, but in the context of healer dps which is what we are talking about I am obviousy able to do it without it. So the qualified to do it in that context doesnt really apply. I still feel apart from that if anyone works hard enough to get there they can, not just based on whether anyone else thinks they can. Groups are different anyone can have whoever they want in them true, but I wouldnt use the word non qualified to describe a non dps healer

So by that virtue because you are able to do it, everyone should be able to?

You yourself have argued against people expecting just because "I" can do something, I shouldn't be able to expect everyone else to do the same.

I'm trying to establish a baseline for discussion. The baseline is savage endgame content. The standard of play expected from those who can clear it is higher than that of the average player. Therefore, the higher than average player is one that generally, though not always, will add dps as well as heal if they are choosing to tackle savage content.

Or, for healers who choose to heal only, I've seen them solo heal pre-Echo. Been on a few of those clears myself and they're pretty amazing. But everyone has to perform their role perfectly to minimize stress on the healer and eliminate the need to waste mp on raises.

Just throwing it out there but there are people who main heal and don't provide any dps at all who still can't do it. Tried and failed. If it was so easy, that savage clear rate would be a lot higher across the entire player base.

[Feyona]

How is it elitist?



You are missing the point. Each static is unique; with their own individual requirements. Casual groups often won't care if you DPS whereas midcore and above will. While you are absolutely allowed into any content you fancy, you cannot dictate the group's standard unless you are the raid leader.

I wont join a hardcore group now Ive been in one but didnt enjoy it. I joined cos I was asked to, and as always said I will try. Its not just the communty my feedback is aimed at its in general. And I do not expect everyone to accept all preferences. Im talking about healer dps not everything. That the force or pressure to do it is totally unecessary. Did you read what the other person said about it or have you completely overlooked what she said? She may quit game cos of it and Im feeling like that too.

[Judge_Xero]

Im not disagreeing with you, but in the context of healer dps which is what we are talking about I am obviousy able to do it without it. So the qualified to do it in that context doesnt really apply. I still feel apart from that if anyone works hard enough to get there they can, not just based on whether anyone else thinks they can. Groups are different anyone can have whoever they want in them true, but I wouldnt use the word non qualified to describe a non dps healer

Did you ever manage to clear A11S or A12S btw? I know you were saying your group is taking a break or something but 15% Echo has really opened up Savage no matter how bad a group you get into in PF/DF. Even if everyone makes mistakes you should be able to heal them through everything with the extra HP and Healing power.

[Lambdafish]

I wont join a hardcore group now Ive been in one but didnt enjoy it.

Then don't! You can so easily join a casual group, a just for fun group, make your own group. You have that power and you don't need to impede on a group that doesn't suit your playstyle. Hardcore groups enjoy what they do, you not joining frees up a slot for a healer who likes the high-pressure environment. You have no right at all to enforce your playstyle on another group when you can so easily create your own group.

[Feyona]

So by that virtue because you are able to do it, everyone should be able to?

You yourself have argued against people expecting just because "I" can do something, I shouldn't be able to expect everyone else to do the same.


Or, for healers who choose to heal only, I've seen them solo heal pre-Echo. Been on a few of those clears myself and they're pretty amazing. But everyone has to perform their role perfectly to minimize stress on the healer and eliminate the need to waste mp on raises.

Just throwing it out there but there are people who main heal and don't provide any dps at all who still can't do it. Tried and failed. If it was so easy, that savage clear rate would be a lot higher across the entire player base.

That is twisting my words as well , I did not say if I can anyone can, I said it proves it can be done without healer dps. That is my point nothing more

[bounddreamer]

Im talking about healer dps not everything. That the force or pressure to do it is totally unecessary. Did you read what the other person said about it or have you completely overlooked what she said? She may quit game cos of it and Im feeling like that too.

Both of you have options. All healers have options. There are pressures in endgame raiding for all players, for both healers. So this "force" that you're so forcefully arguing against can be addressed in a variety of different ways by yourselves, the individuals, rather than expecting the overall community meta to change (which it won't).

Saying that you or anyone may quit the game isn't the catastrophic life event that it may seem to be. Sometimes that is the right choice. It's a personal decision for a personal situation.

[bounddreamer]

That is twisting my words as well , I did not say if I can anyone can, I said it proves it can be done without healer dps. That is my point nothing more

We're going in circles again. Just because it "can" be done doesn't mean that's the way it ought to, or the way people want to. Let's take A10S for example. During the first phase of the fight with healer dps (and high raid wide dps) you can completely skip the first prey and tank swap. You push a phase, reduce healing requirements for the main healer, reduce damage to the tank, and reduce the duration of the fight overall. So if the group can do that, why wouldn't we want to?

Yes. You, personally, can clear A10S without a single global cooldown of dps as a healer.

However, that doesn't make it the baseline expectation for healing in A10S.

[Feyona]

Did you ever manage to clear A11S or A12S btw? I know you were saying your group is taking a break or something but 15% Echo has really opened up Savage no matter how bad a group you get into in PF/DF. Even if everyone makes mistakes you should be able to heal them through everything with the extra HP and Healing power.

No static members on holiday for last few weeks. So not attempted it with 15% echo yet our progression is to around 20%-30% without it. Its just time people dont have so much to spend days we only had once a week. Others I know are getting carried through it, atm, proud owners of an a11s clear that they didnt have to be optimal for. Just kind friends. Its fine idm how anyone does it