seeing all these total newbie tank is hilarious

[dragonseth07]

I never thought I'd see the day when I saw someone throw down an elitism argument for Pokémon of all things in the tank forums. I guess it just goes to show that elitists of a feather will flock together.

Yup, elitist, the word people love to use as an excuse to write someone off on these forums.

Yes, clearly this is a situation where the new player can get some help from a friendly player and improve as a result. Hugs all around.

The problem is that these same players keep going, and keep not learning on their own, only improving when someone else sits down to explain things. Ever met a level 50 Lancer? I have. What about a 60 BLM who thought ice mage was a legit playstyle? We all have.

Players are not held accountable to learn, and that's a problem.

[Jpec07]

Yup, elitist, the word people love to use as an excuse to write someone off on these forums.

Yes, clearly this is a situation where the new player can get some help from a friendly player and improve as a result. Hugs all around.

The problem is that these same players keep going, and keep not learning on their own, only improving when someone else sits down to explain things. Ever met a level 50 Lancer? I have. What about a 60 BLM who thought ice mage was a legit playstyle? We all have.

Players are not held accountable to learn, and that's a problem.

If people weren't so averse to getting off their high horses and teaching others, it wouldn't be as much of an issue.

EDIT: I also realize that some people don't want to be taught, but in my experience it's always worth t to try.

I met a level 34 GLD while fighting Titan on an alt who didn't know that FFXIV even had a job system. The quest appears when you finish the GLD story, but it's red until you get CNJ to 15--and the game doesn't exactly tell you that that's what you're supposed to do (it hints at it, but it's not spelled out). Until Stormblood, a quest to go to the required class hall and level that class to 15 would be very helpful in this regard, but I doubt if they'll add that in. Instead, it's our job as members of the community to teach one another and raise the floor.

I've seen a lot of things. There was an archer in Neverreap in level 30 gear. There was a summoner who didn't know how to use Dreadwyrm Trance or Ruin III, and a BLM who didn't use Enochian. I've seen a CNJ in Stone Vigil (that one hurt), a WAR in Int gear, a DRK who, at level 60, constantly floored their MP and let Darkside fall off. But for all of these, taking five minutes to explain things to them has always helped, and giving them resources for self improvement has always been met with thanks.

And I've seen these players turn around after I took those five minutes, and I've seen them improve themselves and pay it forward.

We who have knowledge and experience did not gain that from thin air. If you read tooltips, quest text, NPC dialogue? You learned to do all of that somewhere. If you search Google for tips on how to minmax your rotation or your opener? You learned to do that somewhere. If you see a bad player at some advanced point in the game? They have probably never learned that. Wouldn't it be nice of you to teach them not only how to play, but how to self improve? Sure, there are people who might not care, but I've never met them.

[dragonseth07]

snip for post length

If I didn't enjoy teaching others, I never would have taught university. I do enjoy seeing people learn and grow. But, teaching taught me one thing very clearly: You can only help so much before people have to start being willing to help themselves.

I helped a lot of students with my Biology courses. I would often see the same student repeatedly. I had a lot of sympathy for everyone who was struggling. Eventually, I realized that many of the people coming back weren't putting in any effort on their own. It was simply easier to rely on my office hours for everything. That's when the sympathy dries up, and I see it a LOT here, too. You say we should teach people how to self-improve. It's as simple as using Google, or Reddit, or these forums. We spend our lives on the internet.

Maybe I'm jaded, but I only really help people who are willing to help themselves, and this game has very few of those people, relatively speaking.

Edit: Just to weigh in on the side conversation, exact enmity modifiers are extremely useful, in my opinion. That said, I am a very mathy person, so I make use of that kind of data pretty readily.

[ToasterMan]

If I didn't enjoy teaching others, I never would have taught university.

Then you of all people should know that many people learn differently. Someone could read an entire book on tanking and they still wouldn't understand it until they actually set foot in there and started doing it for themselves. I know this because I am one of those people. It's why people say that university doesn't prepare you for the real world.

It's the same thing for raiding. I can repeat Mr. Happy videos until the cows come home. I'll never truly understand those mechanics until I try doing them. And guess what? I fail at them. Usually multiple times until I get it. Does my raid team make fun of me for it? Of course not. So why should it be okay to do it to new tanks? Especially when we already have a shortage of them?