Do Something About Duty Finder Already

[Keiko_Kumiko]

The only thing I would like to see changed about the Duty Finder, is that only the player that fails to sign on when it starts gets signed off and replaced by another, instead of signing off everyone, making it have to start over and over.

[Driavna]

.rar

At the end of the day is more about player actitude that anything else, IMO extreme content is in a sweet spot and should be the default for any 8 man outside MSQ, also we need extreme dungeons.

[LalaRu]

I know plenty of people who decided to attempt Extreme Primals only to get utterly demolished.

It maybe helps them understand how much they have to improve, it is not a bad thing:the battles you lose are the ones that helps you more on improve.

The issues is, people nowadays wants only winners in their parties. But to be a winner, you need bite the dust first.

[Zojha]

Zurvan EX proved just how wide the skill gap is.

They've acknowledged the skill gap between players... goodness, 3.3 already? Probably even earlier.

And from what it appears, they do attempt to push the bottom up - by lowering the skill floor for jobs. That's where ideas like permanent Enochian come from. The goal will be to reduce the performance gap with the given skill gap.
And I can already imagine some people here stomping their foot because that's not how they're supposed to go about it.

[Just-Communication]

I see two (or more) sides to this argument. Your proposals seem to stem from the desire for players to learn on their own, as poor performance (or lack or performance) is a burden for others when using duty finder. You are not advocating for players to learn from the community, their FC, or through mentors. You want individual players to improve in a way that does not waste your time.

Along those lines, you are not suggesting that frustrated players go find a social circle and complete instances as a fixed party. You want the duty finder, but also want other player's performance to meet your expectations, which may or may not be reasonable.

When did poor performance (or lack of performance) equate to a waste of one's time in duty finder? The player performing poorly, or miserably as some would put it, do not feel like their time is being wasted. That's you. How much control do you want until you are satisfied? What combos/rotation should complete strangers use to please you?

Yes, there is a need for gratification. Perhaps not instant gratification, but we seem to be gradually moving in that direction. We want results for the effort we put in. It's frustrating when you fail - even more so when it is due to something beyond your control. Something beyond your control. You want to be given reassurance that the behaviors of others in duty finder is subject to measures of control.

You're doing everything right, so why are all these other people screwing up so badly? You want to run through a dungeon like your pants are on fire, like half the mobs should just be grouped together right at the entrance vice spread out, like you can't be bothered, like everything that doesn't go your way is a waste of your time.

There are tests. There are lots of tests in the game; many require a party. But you don't want to be part of their test. You don't want to waste your time.

[Zhamkyong]

The issues is, people nowadays wants only winners in their parties. But to be a winner, you need bite the dust first.

Sometimes also is how they react to players who are learning their job or the fight itself. It happened to me, I picked up machinist as soon as I could, level it and went all HW with it. Then Alexander came, I got into the 4th raid of the first series and passed it with sweat and blood. I knew I was not the best, but I managed to do the mechanics, burst adds down very fast, assist with tp and mp... I was at the peak on that moment, euphoric , as it was my first raid. Then someone who was parsing came and shouted who awful my play had been along with other no so pretty words. I stand my ground and confronted him, but no one else replied and he kept insisting so I decided to leave.

I remember getting really pissed, decided to improve and trying not to mind what that player said. My fc buddies and gf tried to cheer me up, but the damage was done as it wounded me more than I thought. In the end I let the lunchbox and picked up the smn book again, something I sometimes regret. Some players only wants winners, everything done fast and kick out the one who is learning, they don't see the damage they are doing in the process.

[Nyxn607]

I have seen this mentioned over and over in the thread, the best way to solve the problem is for experienced player's to give advice/encourage the newer players that are struggling. There are always and I iterate ALWAYS going to be those few players that refuse to learn or take criticism, they have been given the name of "bads" by the forums.

In my profession in RL and in most MMO's I see it far to often, person A does action C that upsets person B. In response person B does action D, which in turn makes person A upset. This problem could have been solved by a simple communication from person B to Person A for doing Action C. Instead (as people in the thread have put it) elitists/bads get butt hurt and a full out kindergarten name calling circle jerk ensues. If the butt hurt skilled and not so skilled players would for once communicate with each other, they might actually help solve the issue.

Who knew common sense was so hard to come by these days.

[LalafellDown]

Completed A12S in duty finder

[Lozza]

Snip.

Your post makes me sad, while I don't see this behaviour often I've seen it enough outside of raids it is of no surprise why the tank & healer pools are so small.
I bought the game for my sister for her bday last year and we started playing together. Like many MMOs where we play together we often tag team as healer & tank. While she was learning to heal we didn't have too many issues but recently when she started to learn to tank we've had a couple of not so nice instances of overgeared DPS tearing into her in Sastasha for not pulling big, or when she attempted a larger pull not completely holding threat. Players learn by practice.

While I do wish the duty finder might have more restrictions on it to prevent really basic stupidity - like a tank in Qarn (lvl35) in the Novice Hall i17 DPS gear - I did not enjoy healing that run I would be equally in favour of a checkbox along the lines of "speed run" or "I don't want play with newbies".

[Niyuka]

Frankly, the best and possibly only way I have ever seen an MMO be able to actually push the skill floor for its playerbase significantly was by making the normal, day-to-day dungeon play gradually more difficult as you level up, in order to ease people into a higher standard of playing.

Today, the easiest content is the max-level content when it comes to daily routine stuff. That is NOT good design. Easy-to-get gear of high ilvl, coupled with undertuned dungeon fights, creates an atmosphere of "just be there, it ll work out" that is not conducive to better play in actually more challenging content.

People are not stupid, but people ARE lazy. This is a base assumption that has worked very well for me, working in game design for over 15 years now. Make sure that the "Path of least resistance" and the "Path to the rewards" match up, and then gradually turn up the challenge level along that path. People follow the path to rewards, going through the least resistance (or, lacking resistance, the least time involved) almost exclusively.

If you provide decent indicators of WHAT went wrong, along with an obvious or logical way of how to avoid it, people will learn. Boss killed everyone on enrage? Need more DPS. Boss pushed you off the platform? Dodge the AOE. You were instantly killed by a debuff? Find a way to cleanse it.

Titan Extreme is an example of obvious and immediate feedback for almost all his mechanics: You fail, you die of the very same ability. Ravana Extreme - not so good. Double Prey is hard to learn "in-fight" or adjust to, and the accumulating mistakes over several phases can kill you down the road, without immediately knowing why.