Do Something About Duty Finder Already

[Ghastly]

Instead of forcing big pulls you should've pulled small/normal. I have 5000+ commendations, and it's because I'm not trying to clear dungeons in 5 minutes. If the dungeon takes 40 minutes that's not going to cause a calamity.

DF is about helping people out for a common goal. It's not about if they do the rotations exactly how you want.
This is the best thing about FFXIV, people are willing to teach dungeons and for the most part not judge others.

[Gemina]

There is something that can be done, but I'd argue nothing you've listed would do the trick, and SE has clearly decided not to pursue the only course that would usher in significant improvement: challenging players early and often...

... So, given that SE has shown absolutely no desire to introduce real challenge into the typical dungeon, that's the ballgame. FFXIV is going to always be riddled with bad players, because bad players aren't punished. Their progress isn't impeded, their groups can usually survive without them, and the party members they encounter who would otherwise black list them for incompetence aren't even on the same damned server most of the time. No consequences, no learning.

I have to disagree to a certain extent. I understand that relevant endgame content is where the true challenge lies, but from my experience, optional dungeons like Cutter's Cry and Aurum Vale ramp up the difficulty significantly. And even MSQ instances such as Keepers of the Lake, The Navel HM, Ravana HM, The Aery, and The Vault are nothing to scoff at, especially when running them your first time. They don't play around and serve to make a player better, and most will claim that they became better players after learning these instances because they are indeed punished for failing/ignoring mechanics.

I will still agree with the lack of consequences though. I don't like it in general when mechanics can be ignored, and when content has to be nerfed, especially when it is intended to be difficult. These things without question won't teach a player anything. Since you played XI, you should be aware of SE's mistake of making content too difficult. They lost a lot of subs with the genkai quests (particularly raising the caps of levels 50 and 70), and Absolute Virtue pre-nerfs literally sent players to the hospital.

As Yoshi stated iirc, "Be careful what you wish for."

[Fyce]

Damn this thread is so sad.

People defending mediocrity should be ashamed of themselves, but no, they instead think that it's totally normal.
This is exactly why we can't have nice things. The DF in EU and NA is a complete joke because of this awful mentality. Some people argue that it's completly okay to drag everyone down. I bet some are even proud of that "I play how I want" mindset.

If some JP players are reading this thread, they are probably about to throw up... and commit seppuku after reading such atrocities.

[Bourne_Endeavor]

and what would you propose? the "git gud" logic? What if I don't want to?

What if I'm having fun playing the game how I want to, and is willing to continue paying to play the game as such?

I'm not the one here complaining about how good or bad other players are, I'm just having fun doing me.

and what do you suggest to a person who is fed up from playing with other terrible players?

What if my fun is kicking bad players who won't try because how dare I tell them to turn on Gauss Barrel or not spam Blizzard 3?

See, the whole "it's my sub" argument quickly crumbles since it goes both ways. Keep in mind, the devs have come out and said we can kick people for any reason. Therefore, the above is perfectly within the rules. So if we're going to apply this silly 'logic'. Well... like I said. It goes both ways.

[Nestama]

As I said before....join with a fixed party if it happened SO often that you have a bad party. Than you can play with people on "your level"

"My level" is kinda expecting people to not be having night terrors on the keyboard/controller...

Basically, I expect a player to be aware with what they're doing.

[ZioSerpe]

What if my fun is kicking bad players who won't try because how dare I tell them to turn on Gauss Barrel or not spam Blizzard 3?

See, the whole "it's my sub" argument quickly crumbles since it goes both ways. Keep in mind, the devs have come out and said we can kick people for any reason. Therefore, the above is perfectly within the rules. So if we're going to apply this silly 'logic'. Well... like I said. It goes both ways.

[Viki]

And if we are those people, that's our business. If you don't want to play with us people who are terrible at this game, go play another game, or start filling up that block list.

This is sad....

[NanaWiloh]

A proving ground type system and gating Dungeons behind halls will not change things. You have players who know their class and know how to play but choose to play like garbage after a certain point. No amount of additional gating is going to stop these types of players, all you will do is gate the unwilling and uninformed from moving foward in the game. A good player who wishes to be lazy will blow through Halls and training gates join your party and be lazy leaving you with two options; carry them or kick them. This is part of why Blizzard did away with the Proving Ground system in WoW it did little to stop bad and lazy players from going forward into harder Dungeons.

I am all for helping other players play better but they have too want to play better first. As for players who are good and choose to be lazy....well good luck figuring that one out.

[File2ish]

And if we are those people, that's our business. If you don't want to play with us people who are terrible at this game, go play another game, or start filling up that block list.

From a player without a ton of time to play anymore, but is always willing to help others in a manner that doesn't involve insults or put downs:

Like it or not players who choose to play the game without learning the basic mechanics of their chosen job create headaches for other players who put in more effort to learn the game. In the end it creates more headaches for everyone because some players refuse to use even get better and get overly offended when they are told, even as kindly as possible (it's very difficult to give advice to a player that doesn't want to try without sounding like a prick to them), making runs even slower and possibly ending in failure.

I'm always willing to run with players who don't know the game so well, and I always try to lend a helping hand as respectful as possible. But many players lack empathy, view their own time and effort (or lack thereof in some cases) as the most important in the world, and nothing anyone else says matters. Selfishness is unavoidable, but the extent to which some players are selfish is astonishing. Even offering to offer advice to other players if they wanted it got me kicked from parties because I apparently wanted to tell them how to play.

I get it, many players don't want to learn the optimal rotations and whatnot. I'm one of those players, I couldn't care less about what is optimal. But I have enough sense to understand that I'm not the only one playing the game. Do I know optimal rotations for my chosen jobs? No, I didn't delve so deep. I figured out the fundamentals and applied them with what I know about all my other job skills. Is my damage optimal? No. Is it decent? Yeah, an undergeared monk or bard playing decently can easily out DPS an overgeared ninja who didn't care to learn how his mudras or other skills work.

TL;DR

While you may spend your time as you want because it is your business, please consider others time and effort as well. You have to play with us, just as we have to play with you. The least players could do is learn the fundamental (NOT OPTIMAL) mechanics of their chosen job. It baffles me why some people don't even go so far as to learn the basics of a game they're investing hours upon hours playing.

I'm a patient man, but I don't have all the time in the world. I work 10 hour shifts. I have other stuff to do as well, and while you may have your fun playing the way you do, I would hope you also consider my time as I and many others like me are considering yours.

It's like if you played a competitive match in Overwatch; you picked Reinhardt (or any other character) and another picked Mercy, but the Mercy only ran around with her pistol shooting enemies instead of healing saying "I play how I want" excuses instead of playing how she was intended. Everyone else would be expecting heals, but the Mercy is playing how they want. Wouldn't that try your patience? If not be an infuriating waste of time to you? That's how the XIV community feels about players who don't want to learn even the very basics of the game.

[File2ish]

Instead of forcing big pulls you should've pulled small/normal. I have 5000+ commendations, and it's because I'm not trying to clear dungeons in 5 minutes. If the dungeon takes 40 minutes that's not going to cause a calamity.

DF is about helping people out for a common goal. It's not about if they do the rotations exactly how you want.
This is the best thing about FFXIV, people are willing to teach dungeons and for the most part not judge others.

It is, I agree. If a dungeon takes the whole hour and a half. That's fine with me as long as it doesn't end as a failure.

But sadly we get players who do not want to learn. Others who just want a carry. And others who see anything said about them as nothing but an attack on their person.